Whats the highest proof you get??

Thomasedwin

I'm looking to find a short metal frame to put my natural gas 10 jet burner into, The burner frame I have now is 19 inches tall and the ring on top is not large enough diameter to alow a 15.5 gallon keg to set inside the ring making it unstable. It was a propane turkey fryer that I switched to a natural burner. I want something about 12 inches tall with a surface that a keg will set on evenly, I see plenty of different gas burners out there but most are like what I already have, the stand is too tall and the surface of the burner make a keg unstable, or they are really cheap made and look to weak to hold the weight of 15 gallons plus the keg and column. I don't need the burner, I only need the frame with a center bolt hole to mount my burner. I' looking for something pre made that I can just put my burner in. Any Ideas????

Thomasedwin

@Kapea said:

I understand what everyone is saying, I'm just trying to work with what I have before I go and buy new parts or get a completely different column altogether.

Harry

old steel wheel rim is easy and sturdy. Lots of "how to's" on various sites.

punkin

crozdog

bend the legs on your existing stand

Thomasedwin

Good Idea but I cut them off instead. Now I need to find some type of 1/2 inch 20 NF threaded feet or maybe casters and I need to find a way to get the keg to center and not slip off the burner top. I try to do everything I can with hand tools cause I don't have a welder.

dad

Te...want to stop the corrosion on that stand?

Every time you get ready to use it, rub some olive or cooking oil on it and it will season like a frying pan! Stays black, no rust...

Thomasedwin

The white colored top ring gets very hot and the metal tube that contains the jet burner gets cherry red hot. This was a propane turkey fryer burner that I just switched out the propane burner with a natural gas 10 jet burner. When I first put it together I wire brushed the whole thing to bare metal and then painted it with rustolium high temp black stove paint. The first few times I used it the paint burned off stinking up the house, you can see where the black paint remains and just above that you can see where it turns red hot. I don't know that cooking oil would stand up to red hot metal. The 10 jet NG burner I put in there puts out more than 2 x the heat of the original propane burner. I run it at the lowest setting with a blue flame, If I turn it too low I get a yellow flame that makes all kinds of black soot on the boiler so I turn it up just enough to get that blue flame and then it burns clean and at that point it's just the right heat for 15 gallons. That jet burner would turn a frying pan red hot with nothing in it. If I ever had to I could light this little burner with nothing on it and turn the flame up and it would heat the entire house in winter.

Thomasedwin

I have a question, Is it better to have a boiler that is big and round so there is more surface aria of the liquid exposed for more vapor to escape or is it better to have a long skinny boiler with a much smaller aria of liquid exposed???? And by the way has anyone ever thought of using a 1/6 beer keg for a packed column, maybe filling it with large activated carbon stones or something similar???? I asked because I was at a bar-bq and a guy there gave me a Coors 19.5 liter SS keg just to get it out of his garage.

punkin

It doesn't matter what shape your boiler is the amount of vapour is the same and relates directly to the energy input. No, i don't think anyones ever thought of doing that.

grim

Surface area is irrelevant, but a silly shape might be more trouble than it's worth.

Might make a nice thumper too.

CothermanDistilling

I can't wait until @Thomasedwin gets a 15.5/26gal boiler with an electric element and a baby/dash/crystal.... Nothing against you one bit, bud, but others and I have all been where you are, and we want to see your hallelujah moment when you get the awesome gear that this forum is centered on...

Thomasedwin

So the aria of exposed liquid inside a still makes no difference? If you have a 2 square ft aria and a 1 square ft aria the amount of alcohol vapor escaping would be the same for both as long as the volume of liquid and the heat applied is the same for both boilers? It would seem as though if you had a boiler that had a very large surface aria of liquid it would let more vapor escape. Or should I see it as having 2 five gallon boilers side by side, 1 boiler has 1 sqft area and the other has 2 sqft aria, the boiler with the larger aria would let off a curtain amount of vapor and then the boiler with less aria would let of the same amount of vapor only more concentrated because it has a smaller aria to escape from? So if you could build any size still that you wanted, would you build one with a large boiler surface aria like a kids swimming pool or would you build a tall skinny boiler like a 10 foot tall beer keg???

punkin

I'll say it once again. It makes no difference. The example of two boilers you have cited would behave exactly the same and there would be the same amount of vapour and it would not be more concentrated.

Thomasedwin

@CothermanDistilling said: I can't wait until Thomasedwin gets a 15.5/26gal boiler with an electric element and a baby/dash/crystal.... Nothing against you one bit, bud, but others and I have all been where you are, and we want to see your hallelujah moment when you get the awesome gear that this forum is centered on...

I would order a crystal dragon right now If I had a few grand laying around

jacksonbrown

Like the others are saying, the volume of vapour produced is proportional to the energy you can get into the boiler.
For the gas or jacket guys, a short wide boiler will have a lot more surface area in contact with your heating medium which increases efficiency.
I think that's more the reason why traditional pots a very squat. It's not so much about the surface area of the liquid but more to do with heat contact area. Just sticking some fire under a pot wastes a lot of energy. I have back packing stoves that even have fins welded to the bottom of them to suck out more heat from the exhaust gasses so I can go a week on one can.
Another benefit of short and fat is foaming will be knocked back a lot quicker on a larger surface so a bit less chance of puking.

FloridaCracker

@jacksonbrown said: I think that's more the reason why traditional pots a very squat.

I thought that fat and squat was more to reduce height. In my search for my next boiler, that is my main consideration.

jacksonbrown

That's definitely a legitimate concern for small operations and home guys but the better way to do it is to design the building to suit the still (and all the peripheral gear). That's not always an option though.

Thomasedwin

Well, I got my keg back from the fab shop and I spent a day cleaning up the welds cause the buttheads didn't pickle them for me. I cleaned them best I could with muriatic acid to remove the black then hit the whole thing with marine jelly and then filled it with water and a couple pounds of citric acid for a good boil and left it soak over night then in the morning I rinsed and scrub brushed every inch inside and out and let it drain and dry. I also did a good citric acid soak of all my copper parts. I've had 30 gallons of sweet corn mash setting for about 10 days overdo so today I gave my new keg boiler a final hot water rinse and started it's maiden first 15 gallon run. I first packed the column half full of freshly cleaned copper scrubbers and put it together with the copper plates that I tried to turn into a short dephlagmator, If you are following my adventure. It took about an hour and a half to get to output temp and I expected to get a steady output stream coming out of the leg end Instead after 10 mins nothing happened then it gave a good gush of output and I thought it was going to puke so I waited and it gave another big gush bigger than the last so I shut it down. I removed the copper scrubbers and put it back together with just the copper plates and turned the heat back on, again I expected to get a steady stream of output but instead nothing happened for about 20 mins, then I got a little stream of output then a small gush and then nothing, then a little stream then another little gush. It continued like this without puking so I let it go. At this point I have about 2 gallons collected and it's still running. Instead of a continuous stream I'm getting a strange purculator output like those old coffee pots from the 1950's. I still have 15 gallons of mash left in my 30 gallon fermenter barrel for a second run so I'm going to run them both into the same container and then check the proof and see if it's better than what I had before. This thing is sounding like glug-glug-glug and then a half once output then glug- glug- glug and another output, Am I making liquor or coffee.

grim

Glug-glug-glug - sounds like you have a low point in your piping where distillate is collecting and then being flushed.

Looking back at the old pictures, you have that really long horizontal section to your collection vessel, that might be a problem.

FloridaCracker

Did you do a cleaning run before putting your good stuff in the still?

Thomasedwin

I didn't do a cleaning run first I only soaked all my copper parts in a strong hot citric acid bath but they were already pretty clean anyway and then did the keg with muriatic acid then marine jelly rust remover that has phosphoric acid and then the boil with strong citric acid and a good scrub brushing and a good water rinsing after each acid cleaning. The inside of that keg is spotless. I never really understood why someone would make a mash just to do a cleaning run other than to wash out maybe possible contaminants inside the copper pipe or something, If you I do a citric acid wash and rinse every couple months so I know everything is perfectly clean, the only problem with acid cleaning copper is it takes a little bit of surface metal away every time you do it but at least you know it's as clean as you can get. I see why all those crystal dragons are made of stainless steel because they only need a rinsing to clean but there is something to be said for copper because copper is antibacterial and it also pulls out sulfides from the distillate, I'm torn between using copper or stainless steel. Is that the reason they have been using copper to make stills out of for hundreds of years or because they didn't have stainless steel??? Anyhow the first run put out around 143 proof or 71 % ABV so I'm not getting any improvement but the difference is it only took 3 & 1/2 hours to run 15 gallons instead of 5 hours.

punkin

Who would have thought that?

There is copper in the SD stills in the plates and the caps. It's enough to affect any sulfide you may construct into a wash.

FloridaCracker

The copper VS stainless debate is one that will probably continue for a long time but like you pointed out it was probably an availability thing in the past and not a function thing. Also, I would think at this point in history, mashes and washes are made with minimal shit that needs the copper to pull out. Back in the day when all kinds of stuff ended up in the mash, copper was needed more. Like Punkin pointed out, a little bit in a still should be enough unless you are fucking up your mash.

Actually, in my 4 plate still with ProCaps I consider that I have a LOT of copper contact; it just isn't seen from the outside.

As far as the cleaning run goes, it is totally up to you as you will be the one drinking what you make but current wisdom dictates that anytime you add parts to your still especially copper parts, a cleaning run is recommended.

Thomasedwin

The only thing that I really changed is the boiler, I'm using the 15 gallon keg instead of the stockpot.

Thomasedwin

I just started the second run and I found why I was getting that glug-glug perculator effect, With using the stock pot the lid is much thinner and the weight of the column and long side leg was enough to tilt it to one side just enough to let the output run down hill out of the leg, With using the new beer keg it's much sturdier than the stock pot and it held the leg just about horizontal so it was just enough to cause a little build up in the leg causing that purculator effect. All I had to do was give the joint at the bottom of the condenser a little downward bend, not even 2 degrees and that cured it, now I'm getting a stronger constant stream coming out even better than before. I dumped that 143 proof first run in the boiler and turned on the flame and when the heat got to the top of the column the thermometer jumped up to 173 degrees F and right away I got a good stream, It's only been about 20 mins and I already got a half gallon in the jug. I'm going to let it run till it gets to 200 F and then shut it down.

Thomasedwin

I finished the second run, I started out with 4 gallons of 143 proof and when the top of the still column reached 200 F I shut it down and it left me with 3 gallons of something in the jug, I'm going to let it set for an hour or so before I use the hydrometer test, it's still a little warm.

grim

4 gallons in, 3 gallons out? You are doing more work than you need to.

crozdog

especially as it was around 70% to start with

Thomasedwin

The 4 gallons of 143 proof turn into 3 gallons of 182 proof in about 3 hours. The most work I did was setting up the still, filling my sink with water and watching it. I'm still disappointed. I want to get 180 proof in a single run. I only make $12. an hour so I can't afford to buy a crystal dragon and I don't have enough celling room to have a 8 foot packed column. The only good thing about it is the quality of the liquor, The sweet corn and sugar recipe I use makes a very good tasting and smelling corn liquor if you can call it that, Everyone who tries it loves it and tries to get me to sell it to them but I just don't sell it. Like you say it isn't so much the work but the time it takes to make it. I see all these adverts about copper coils and reflux columns and there are a thousand of them. I have been thinking about it and the thing I need is a 8 inch x 4 or 5 bubble plate crystal dragon with a good dephlag on top that will attach to my condenser and mount to my 8 inch ferrule on my 15 gallon beer keg. Wish full thinking.