Carter Head vs. Boiler

Grip

We've been distilling gin for a few months now and so far we have always put our botanicals in the GB4 (Carter Head). Very happy with the results, at the moment we refill it every 15 litres and if necessary we slightly change the quantities as we go - 8 to 10 changes per batch.

I would be very interested to hear opinions on the results you get when you put the botanicals in the boiler v Carter Head. Is there a difference in taste and/or aroma? Do some botanicals do better in the boiler? Do the oils foul up your column? Do you need diferent quantities of botanicals?

Over to you.

grim

I'm not a gin guy by any means, but I had a discussion with a guy who was, and his claim was that different botanicals were better suited towards different techniques, with some botanicals better suited towards maceration in the spirit prior to distillation (with botanicals still in), and others that were not suited towards maceration, and instead should be placed in the carter head. Primarily this was to reduce bitterness and off flavors for botanicals that couldn't go for a long maceration without extracting harsher flavors. What he didn't tell me is where he put what...

TheMechWarrior

Have a crack at placing everything but your delicate floral and citrus notes in the boiler ;) Save those for the basket. Let me know what you think of the end result.

Cheers,

Mech.

CothermanDistilling

I do like gin that had botanicals soaked for 36 hours in ~60abv nuetral, then removed, and discarded... it is my wife's favorite, and was made by a member here, @ProofProf

Smaug

Michael, the barrel aged is also spectacular. Keep you eyes peeled for that one.

Myles

I would agree with TMW. Hard botanicals in the boiler, citrus and herbs in the GB4.

An alternative is to go down the other route. Everything in the basket, but only 1 at a time. Build a stock of botanical essences and then blend.

CothermanDistilling

I love me some barrel aged gin... roundhouse, Corsair, and BIG are the ones I have tried and then bought, I like them all...

brewsmith

So @CothermanDistilling, is that gin is macerated, then bottled with no further distillation or redistilled after the 36hrs?

Kill_Devil_Spirit_Co

@Grip is there any particular reason you chose 15L to do your changes or is that just what you found best for your particular set up? just got my gb4 (and still) and not used to being able to change anything out.

CothermanDistilling

@brewsmith said: So CothermanDistilling, is that gin is macerated, then bottled with no further distillation or redistilled after the 36hrs?

no, distilled after.... vodka grade neutral reduced to 60%, macerated 36 hours, then I assume reduced to 40% (with the botanical rinse water maybe?) and redistilled, keeping all, including what would normally be fores, which means your neutral better be good!

Grip

No good reason @Kill_Devil_Spirit_Co . That's what we did first time, it worked well so we've never changed it. Maybe it would do for 20 or 25 litres. I'll probably try extending it with one or two baskets next time.

Lloyd

I really could see the need to have a small, dedicated gin still with a Carter-Head. Some botanicals in the boiler and still being able to swap out botanical baskets.
The idea of not contaminating your main spirit boiler with hard-to-remove flavors from the botanicals is the very reason to have a C-H style gin basket BUT if the still was a dedicated gin still it could open up a whole new set of protocols and opportunities for flavor development.

Just as I'd try to isolate those bot-flavors from contacting my bourbon or vodka, with a dedicated gin rig I'd be much more willing to toss a shovelful of botanicals directly into the boiler.

Grip

I've heard that putting the botanicals in the Carter Head gives rounder more suble flavours. Macerating botanicals and then putting them into the boiler giving harsher flavours but uses less botanicals for the same flavour strength. This is what I've heard, I'm just looking for verification of this. Also which botanicals work best with which method. I'm happy with the way we are doing it, I'm just trying to educate myself a bit!

Myles

@Grip you are correct. The 2 methods use fundamentally diferent techniques. Boiling the botanicals extracts water and solvent soluble aromatics into the boiler.

Vapour extraction in the main just EVAPOURATES volatile components that are carried by the vapour stream.

That is a drastic simplification but it gets the general idea over. Personally I think a combination targeted at specific botanicals makes sense. Some in the boiler and others in the basket.

Just my opinion though.

Sunshine

We talked with some local gin producers about how they do it. It all comes to this: they don't really tell you, what they do and what botanicals they use. All is a top secret. So far I found out, that almost everyone of them uses maceration and distillation and a carter head too. It makes sense to me, that flowery and delicate aromas are best added via the gin basket - but, for example juniper could go for me in both ways.

CothermanDistilling

there may be benefit to some botanicals to have them removed before it is warmed, you may pull the wrong things out of them, either in the vapor basket or the boiler. you want to see secret? Ask a rum distiller about their dunder program, LOL...