March Chugger Pump safe for moving Raw Spirit?

nvnovrts

Is the hot wort pump, march chugger. safe to pump spirits?

Grudaire

I use a march and a chugger for brewing, both are excellent. I can tell you the stainless heads are safe to 250 and the parts that touch the liquid being transferred are made of stainless, silicone, Teflon, and polysulfone. However, I'm not savvy on what materials are safe for high abv as I only ever transfer water, wort, and beer. Hope that helps though.

crozdog

@nvnovtrs, march pumps have a ploysulphone or ss housing. both are recommended for use with ethonol according to this site but note only limited polysulphone contact is recommended at 95%....

dunno what the chugger pumps are made of

punkin

Perhaps ask for recommendations on ADI, those guys use pumps to transfer spirits all the time?

grim

March chugger pump is not explosion proof, if that is important to you. Given a fast spinning impeller and some air entrainment in your hoses, you could be making some vapor during transfer.

A small teflon ball/seal air-powered diaphragm pump would work well, power it with your compressor. Ground it well and you've got as close to explosion proof as you can get without a siphon (obviously your compressor should be located some distance away, or in another area).

Stainless, acetal, or poly housings. Or a full teflon housing if you've got some spare cash.

You might find one on eBay for cheap if you look hard enough. Yamada is well regarded in the industry, don't fall off your chair when you see the prices, there are some less expensive alternatives.

Don't go bigger than a half-inch, you don't need it for transfer unless you are moving major volume. Even these small pumps can move a tremendous volume. Benefit is that they can pull suction, so you don't need to start a siphon to run the pump.

Pick up some ear plugs too, they make a racket.

I've seen some guys who were critical about agitation and oxidation use CO2 and Nitrogen to provide a bit of positive pressure in a closed vessel in lieu of a pump. You could probably come up with a rather elegant system using corny kegs for storage of spirits and low wines and not need to use a traditional pump at all.

irishman

The plastic head march pump is pretty good. It doesn't have any contact with the shaft of the motor because it's a magnet drive hub so you're about as safe as a pump can get. I assume the chuggers are the same, but i've only seen the march on the inside. Depending on the resistance of the material march is using, the liquid is pretty well isolated from any electrical stuff.

grim

It's not direct contact with the liquid, but the open venting on the motor that's the issue when dealing with vapor.

DistilliTraK

Question - I was reading up on both flavors (march and chugger) and the suppliers say they must be primed.. Am I confused about the suction draw and no siphon is required or is that the air in the lines that can cause a vapor generation (I.e. th air in the line between the primed pump head and the wort/backset/etc you are wanting to relocate?)

Edit: I should state I am looking at the stainless models... Nothing less (I'm anal)...

nvnovrts

Vapor and explosion proof. Safety First, Boys!. I want a march for the brewing/wort/sparg. Positive pressure using a corny as a holding vessel might do the trick. I'm thinking of carbon filtering for the spirits and a small RO for the water treatment. I was wondering if one pump could do both, but it sounds like you really need two. Yes the membrane pumps are a bit pricey.

punkin

What about peristaltic pumps? The pump has no contact with the fluid then.

I saw a how to make your own and linked it a while back...

Inexpensive, easy to build, peristaltic pump

This idea is easily adaptable to something a bit more substantial.

grim

I was able to find a cleaned and rebuilt polypropylene ARO with teflon seals and balls for under $200 on ebay, it's a $900+ pump retail. It's relatively small, but it'll do 13gpm full out, nice thing is you can very easily control the flow rate by varying the compressor pressure. Rebuilding it is a piece of cake as long as you can handle ordering some parts online and turning a crescent wrench. It's amazing how simple and elegant these things are. I've seen smaller versions even cheaper. The only real problem is trying to decipher the manufacturer product numbers to understand what materials are used where (since the sellers with the best prices tend to be clueless about what they have).

Not much more expensive than a chugger pump, assuming you've already got a compressor.

I may regret giving away the eBay pump secret the next time I've got a hankerin' for a new Yamada.

Grudaire

@DistilliTraK said: Question - I was reading up on both flavors (march and chugger) and the suppliers say they must be primed.. Am I confused about the suction draw and no siphon is required or is that the air in the lines that can cause a vapor generation (I.e. th air in the line between the primed pump head and the wort/backset/etc you are wanting to relocate?)

Edit: I should state I am looking at the stainless models... Nothing less (I'm anal)...

Yes both the march and the chugger have to be primed. This is best done with gravity feeding. If you do not allow a path for air to go it will trap in the pump head. For us brewers that can cause a loss of prime which is mildly annoying. It sounds like from what others are saying this would allow a pocket for vapors to collect though. Perhaps impellers may cause some level of cavitation that may result in vapor formation. This has not been my experience with either chugger or march, but I really don't worry with wort either.

DistilliTraK

Thanks - I am mostly interested in the loading of wort, and unloading backset at the end. I still like the idea of stainless even thou it's overkill for wort/backset..

CothermanDistilling

I have a friend who has supplied me with many, many march and other pumps... I have used the mag-drive pumps for all beer use and spirits and also have used a macerator pump, you know, a boat sewage pump... (but it was brand new :-)... he has supplied many a craft brewery with pumps, and has started with distilleries... anyone in the US, he will hook you up... he has a chugger in his stash too, but does not sell them, they don't seem to have the SD level of QC... I have forwarded this thread to him and will post his response... he has a pump ready for me when I get my DSP, XP(explosion proof) motor, variable drive, and flexible impeller(positive displacement), can suck honey out of a container if you need it to... DEPCO Pump Company is the company he works for...

grim

That there's a $2k pump

CothermanDistilling

oh, the key to march pumps quality over chugger besides obvious build QC is the magnets are strong enough to work even though magnets get very weak near boiling liquid temps, and also, the clearances can handle getting warm and not seizing.. the housing may be stainless or not, but the impeller is usually plastic with a stainless shell....

CothermanDistilling

Here you all go... from my friend Jeff Allen....

For wort, either a March or Chugger will work. Chugger is 100% Chinese, and they have a high QC rejection by the US importer. March is made in Chicago by a 3rd generation German-American family, and quality for this piece of equipment for the price is outstanding. And March offers a new range of dedicated beer/wort pumps

But neither of these pumps are suitable for spirits. Wort only. Motors are not available in an XP enclosure. I've been selling a ton of these to micro-distillery OEMs: JABSCO Models 30550-2XXX, 30550-3XXX, 30550-4XXX, 30550-5XXX (PDF)

Expensive, yes, but available w/XP motor, sanitary design, will self prime, will pump cooled wort, honey, molasses, and finished spirits with the addition of a VFD (pump needs to run slower when pumping thicker liquids). Contact Jeff Allen, Jason Hebert, or David Farrer at Depco pump, www.depcopump.com or 800-446-1656.

jbierling

@CothermanDistilling said: Expensive, yes, but available w/XP motor, sanitary design, will self prime, will pump cooled wort, honey, molasses, and finished spirits with the addition of a VFD (pump needs to run slower when pumping thicker liquids). Contact Jeff Allen, Jason Hebert, or David Farrer at Depco pump, www.depcopump.com or 800-446-1656.

Out of curiosity, how expensive is expensive?

grim

If you need to move a viscous mash with solids, 3/4HP is going to be a bit on the small side. Realistically with hoses and fittings you are probably pushing like 3-5 gpm.

For what you will need to pay for the VFD, Explosion proof motor, pump head and cart, you are probably better off just going with a 1-2hp pump. The increase in cost is probably minor in comparison to the ticket price.

CothermanDistilling

@jbierling, I am going to say contact him. The main reason is if he wants to shoot you a really good deal, he does not have to give every person for eternity that reads this thread a good deal...

@grim, you may be right, Jeff is a friend, he can give references of the exact distilleries that have gotten what size and if they are happy or would have gone bigger... also something that may be not best posted here. but I have seen people empty a 350gallon tote with the 3/4hp sucking molasses-thickness liquid