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In this Discussion
- CothermanDistilling January 2017
- Fiji_Spirits January 2017
- grim January 2017
- jacksonbrown January 2017
- richard January 2017
- Ryan January 2017
- Unsensibel January 2017
Comments
I really just want to experiment with cool temperature vapor extraction of botanicals. It'll be loaded with GNS.
After thinking about a rotovap a while, I figured it would be significantly cheaper for me to just do it myself. I'm going for pretty small scale -single gallon boiler, single gallon collection vessel, small in-line botanical basket. Worst case, I have a good chiller and vac pump for the rotovap.
I have a spare chiller, but it's a standard temperature chiller. When I try to push it to 30F or so, it can hit the temp, but really has trouble staying staying that low, put any kind of heat load to it, and it wants to be back at 50-60F. Seems it's sweet spot is about 30-40F below ambient. I'm not HVAC expert, but it was explained to me that this is specifically due to the type of chiller - and chillers intended to be efficient at low exit temperatures, need to be designed for that. I'd just rather run the condensers and cold trap very cold.
My vac pump is just an el-cheepo HVAC unit, oil type. I can pull vacuum just fine, but I suspect I'll just be contaminating the oil, especially if I'm starting and stopping vacuum to dump the collection vessel. A good dry style vacuum pump is what most of the rotovap and solvent extraction units are. No sense killing a good pump.
The design is the same as I talked about above, the only difference is that I'm planing to eliminate the element. I'll use a low wattage band heater on the "boiler", and a stir-plate below (to stir to prevent bumping).
Big question I have is whether or not a botanical basket is even required, if I'm working a few degrees above room temperature, does it really matter? The only challenge is that it would make the stir plate difficult.
I swear heartmagic.com had an option for vacuum on their page, using the glass stuff, they use pyrex stuff for vacuum all the time...
Oh, and they make 50L rotovaps...
Polyscience/VWR FT-25 low temperature chiller. Fixed set point of -13f/ -25c. The manual actually has a warning that water can not be used in the chiller.
Cold vapor extracted gin anyone?
I just want a liter of cucumber distilled at 120F or below...
Trying to come up with an elegant method for pre-cooling the boiler and cooling the collection tank to be able to run lower operating temps.
Hoping I can pre-cool the neutral down substantially, than use a low-wattage band heater to control the boil. I don't want to have to try to use a water jacket tank on the boiler.
Or, if I really pull vac, can I get by with cooling loops on both tanks, but control the boil with the boiler cooling loop, and only use external/ambient temps for heating.
Seems like the easiest method is just going to be wrapping the triclamp spool in copper tubing.
Ok, through dumb luck I find myself in possession of a Vacuubrand MD1C, which should have no problem pulling down to a boiling point well below 20c/68f.
why cool the boiler? I though most ran at 120F-ish?
I suspect that's only because they have no options but to use unchilled tap water for cooling.
If my chiller can keep up with the input power, I should be able to bring the condenser temps down dramatically. So, I could pull a lower vacuum, and reduce the boiling point further - but only if I can drop the starting boiler temperature to below the even lower boiling point.
If I pull down to 50 torr, I need to keep the boiler under 60f to start, and I need to keep the collection vessel below 60f as well (roughly, give or take). Or, if the condenser is cold enough, I might be able to sub-cool the condensate enough that the collection vessel stays below boiling passively.
where do you get these wonderful toys? amazing.
I had a customer today request me to produce HPLC grade ethanol for them. looking at glassware and filters now. they also asked for Acetic acid. hell might as well make that too if it'll bring in some cash!! might be a great use for tails cuts. turn it around for $45aud/l.
I'm thinking a 2-5L glass still to purify to HPLC standards and some testing equipment.
What a fun rabbit hole I found when they wont let me make drinking hooch (yet). lol
Yep, that'll do - what an awesome vac pump.
Speaking of vacuum, the following are pictures from my bottle filler where I evacuate bottles prior to CO2 rinse, pressurisation and final filling. The vacuum is venturi from air supply at 5.5 bar. I am quite chuffed with the achieved values.
Water powered vacuum aspirator would be great in this application too. No electrics and any inadvertent vapor will get knocked down in the liquid.