Welcome!
Be part of our community & join our international next generation forum now!
Categories
In this Discussion
- captainshooch November 2013
- Coll July 2013
- Lloyd November 2013
- moscca June 2013
- Myles November 2013
- punkin November 2013
- rossco May 2013
- Smaug November 2013
- VARocketry November 2013
Pints Fast Fermenting Mollasses Wash
This recipe came from Pint o shine on Artisan Distiller and is posted in full here http://www.artisan-distiller.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=58
It is a perfect recipe for a white rum run through 5-6 plates or a navy rum run through 3-5 plates. If making a white rum, leave out the dunder.
I would like to contribute a recipe for a really vigorous fermenter with a very good taste. Best of all no long cook time.
I mix all my stuff in a large 25 gallon pot.
First I add 6.5 gallons rain water (important ingredient, no chlorine). I then measure up the wall to twice the height to know when to stop adding water. I add 3 gallons of GFS (Gordon’s Food Service) Black Strap Molasses.
In a separate pot, on the stove, I put one gallon of rain water. To this I add 4 one a day style multi-vitamins that I have crushed thoroughly in mortar. I then add 13 teaspoons of DAP (one tsp per gallon of wash). I then add one cup (from GFS 2 pound bag) of Red Star active dry baking yeast. I bring this to a boil and simmer for 15 minutes.
Add the contents from the small pot to the large container. Add another cup of dry yeast. Top up with water to the mark. Stir everything thoroughly. I use a paint stirrer and a drill and aerate well.
This gets split between two 6.5 gallon carboys. The first time I tried this I had to drill out the holes in the fermentation locks to keep them from coming off the bottles. This stuff generates a bit of heat so I don’t have to supply any in a 68 degree F room. The last time I made this it fermented completely in 36 hours. This is pretty good for bakers yeast.
After this is distilled (I use a pot still with a glass doubler) this is a fine drink. Despite the aggressive taste of the molasses, it comes off really smooth for white rum. The vigorous and fast fermentation along with the rain water keep the off tastes to a minimum.
I usually get 2.3 gallons of 100P. I usually hit my expected yield.
StillDragon Australia & New Zealand - Your StillDragon® Distributor for Australia & New Zealand
Comments
Why do you use rainwater Punkin? Does chlorine slow the fermentation process down? That's a really good yield.
That's Pints recipe mate and his quote. I use tap water and it works just fine. Haven't brewed rum for years as my mates don't drink it.
StillDragon Australia & New Zealand - Your StillDragon® Distributor for Australia & New Zealand
Quote from Pints recipe :
This is confusing to me : Some people swear by slow fermentation, NOT to stress the yeast. Others make yeast bombs to speed up fermentation to keep the off tastes to a minimum.
Those off tastes, what are they tasting ?
Maybe time for doing a side by side test.
M.
Truly excellent question, Moscca.
The ultimate goal is to get a strong, healthy, abundant population of yeast cells into the ferment at the very beginning and provide an environment where they are not stressed by too much sugar, temperatures too high for them to cope or starving for nutrients for a quick and clean ferment. Ideally the yeast will convert all the available sugars into alcohol and then quickly settle to the bottom.
Well, that's the goal but they have to be coerced to perform and behave that way.
There are several tricks I've heard about, yeast bomb, nutes, and even giving the ferment a good stir after it finishes to release the CO2 so the yeast will settle to the bottom of the fermenter. All good I'm sure. So is racking the "distiller's beer" off the lees and into another secondary fermenter for further clarification.
It's been mentioned often that yeast is your friend to ferment but not so much when it comes to distilling. The whole idea of double distilling - a stripping run followed by a spirit run - is to get even further away from the yeast (plus the benefit of easier cuts).
Folks talk about the benefits of ageing the wash before distilling. I assume that would further settle the yeast out of suspension.
Yes the solids do fall out of suspension. But it seems there is a bit of oxidizing that occurs (at least here in my climate) a change that allows the beer to take on an ever so slight nutty smell that changes to a more chocolate smell when the heat is applied, I am reminded of the "Rancino" discussion on the Rum Talk thread (and others) on HD
StillDragon North America - Your StillDragon® Distributor for North America
When the beer guys talk about ferment speed they are talking about pitching rates (they have controlled temp and the wort is a known entity). They calculate the number of cells needed and pitch at that rate.
When underpitching the dangers are a long lag phase before the yeast starts up working in numbers because of the need to multiply, and higher production of fusels and other byproducts.
When overpitching (like pitching wort on a full yeast bed) the dangers are loss of 'yeast character' meaning fusels and other byproducts as the yeast races through to completion without the reproduction stage (or much reduced) meaning there is less flavour from the yeast in your beer.
All this is of course very dependent on having the correct amount of dissolved oxygen in your wort.
I hope these two scenarios provide you with some room for thought and you can apply this to your question.
StillDragon Australia & New Zealand - Your StillDragon® Distributor for Australia & New Zealand
Cholrine won't slow the firmetation down. There are very minimal parts per million of Chlorine in normal Town/City drinking water for human consumption, so nothing to worry about, you won't tell the difference, unless you have a light mash/wash. If chlorine is worrying, boil it and put it through carbon.
In fermentation speed, I believe it's what temp you brew at and what you want to acheive from it. Punkin is spot on with beer guys with pitching rates (I also brew all- grain beer). If you underpitch, the will be a considerable lag, so if you pitch at the correct rates, the yeast will multiply from the starter and catch up the fermintables in the mash/wash (I assume a yeast bomb is the same thing here) without stressing and freaking out. At the correct rates, this will prevent minimal wild yeast to become dominate, so the pitched yeast is and will the be strongest and dominate and stop little nasties getting in.
The hotter you ferment, the quicker it ferments, but you can/may get off flavours in the wash/mash. The colder you ferment, the chances of not getting the yeast active enough to become the dominate yeast and could invite wild bacteria/yeast.
I have a badly stalled mash that I need to restart before it goes bad. A sticky yellow almost stringy surface coverage is forming after days of stalled mash.
" I then add 13 teaspoons of DAP (one tsp per gallon of wash). I then add one cup (from GFS 2 pound bag) of Red Star active dry baking yeast. I bring this to a boil and simmer for 15 minutes."
Q1: Where can you buy DPA Locally in USA? Need to restart a batch today!
Q2: I don't understand the "boil the yeast", doesn't that kill the yeast? Or are you , in essense, using YEAST to make a substitute for using DME as the beer brewing folks discuss when making starters?
Slow down @VARocketry. Is the wash even close to being able to run? If so then by all means run it and and use the backset/dunder in your next rum wash. Any unused sugars can be assimilated by the yeasts in the next batch so you waste nothing.
If it does not have enough alcohol in the wash to make distilling worthwhile then you probably have either a pH or temperature problem. Make sure the ferment is at about 5 pH, a little less is OK too, more simple to add water before adding chemicals. Keep the ferment at normal room temperature.
Using EC-1118 yeast to restart a stuck ferment is common practice. But sticking a ferment in the first place is something you need to get your head around. The MOST common problem is making the sugar content so rich that the yeast are stressed from the get-go. Another is not whipping some oxygen into the wash in the beginning to promote rapid yeast cell multiplication (the aerobic stage).
Boiling yeast is just to provide nutrients. Its an insurance step and is not absolutely necessary. As distillers we tend to throw lots of spent yeast away but a quick boil of that spent yeast can provide the fresh yeast with the nutes to achieve a rapid ferment.
Bottom line is less is better. Too much of any one thing can have adverse affects on your ferment and that includes your sugar content. Don't shoot for more than 12% ABV. Don't let the ferment experience big swings in temperature changes.
@VARocketry I'll try to answer Q.1 DAP stands for Diammonium Phosphate, basically a ferilizer of 18-46-0, 18%N, 46%P2O5 and 0%K2O available from farm supply stores or as yeast nutrient(which contains DAP among other chemicals) from brew suppliers. It is mostly used nutrition for promoting healthy cell walls on reproducing yeast cells as when hydrading dry yeast to improove reproduction and a healthy yeast population prior to pitching. It helps minimise stress which can be fatal to the yeast culture and feeds the reproducing yeast before they start munching on the sugars. Hope this helps.
I modified my fermentation setup for rum and now use a variation of the technique described. My nutrient source is exclusively boiled yeast.
Where I live I can walk into a supermarket and get a few ounces of fresh yeast absolutely free - just ask at the bakery section. This gets put in the freezer and used as required for nutrients.
The only things I add to whatever mix of sugar and molasses I use, are lemon juice, a multi vitamin tablet and Magnesium Sulphate (Epson Salts).
For fermentation yeast I now use a cool temperature lager or real ale yeast and work with slow fermentations. I also aim for a final target of no more than 11%.
I also use a starter (50:50 diluted wash) which I run in a gallon demijon for 24 hours prior to adding to the fermenter.
Some mollasses had preservatives added to stop spontaneous fermentation.
StillDragon Australia & New Zealand - Your StillDragon® Distributor for Australia & New Zealand
+1 we see this often (for livestock) when the product is cut to 33% to stretch profit.
StillDragon North America - Your StillDragon® Distributor for North America