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Fermenting UJSSM

I hydrated distillers yeast (8 tsp in 3 cups of water @ 100°F). The water had yeast nutrients and DME (for the yeast sugars) dissolved into it. I pitched that hydrated yeast in my UJSSM. The first 48 hours it was bubbling out of the fermenter lock 1-2 every second, now about 5 days into the ferment the bubbling has slowed to about 1 every minute.

  1. Is that about right?
  2. How long do you let it ferment?
  3. How long can you let it sit?
  4. Should I open the lid and test the final gravity or should I wait a few more days at this slow bubble?

Thanks for any help.

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Comments

  • Mine usually takes at least a week to completely stop. I'm on my 5th generation. I would let it sit for at least a couple more days. Or months. It won't hurt unless something nasty gets in there. Also, the wash will take time to clear. The clearer the wash the better the hooch IMHO.

  • It would be fine to leave it on the grains for weeks? Do you use an auto siphon to remove it off the grains to the boiler or do you rack it to another vessel to let it clear more before stripping it. Thanks!

  • FloriaCracker when you say 5th gen, does that mean you've pull 1/3 of the grains off added backseat and sugar 5 times?

  • Here is a link to a huge UJSM thread which Uncle Jesse Started himself with 2000+ posts

    or here is a condensed version of the thread... condensed to 3 pages

    I am sure you will find every answer or question re UJSM already there...

    Have fun reading and happy stillin,

    FS

  • Great! Thanks FullySilenced

  • @Kdog said: FloriaCracker when you say 5th gen, does that mean you've pull 1/3 of the grains off added backseat and sugar 5 times?

    Yep, but I don't remove 30% of the grains I just remove what is "spent" or done. I do this twice after emptying my fermenter of wash. I remove off of the top of the grain bed all of the gray looking stuff. You will know when you start seeing the yellow corn below it. Then after adding back the backset, water, sugar, etc, you will see more of the gray shit float to the top because of the SG. I then remove that, pitch the yeast and let 'er rip. I have a 30 gallon fermenter and my grain bed is usually about 1/3 of the way up. Each Gen I remove about 2 gallons of spent grains and then add back the 2 gallons total that were removed. Not sure of the ratio but it is less than 1/3 of the total grainbed.

  • I have been doing a style like this for a while, I agree with most comments and a few hints to help.

    My fermenting barrels are 60-80lt food grade ex olive tubs, I fitted a tank connector and tap about 6" from the bottom. This means the outlet is just above all the grain bed by an inch or so, very easy to use, a bucket fits under it, and very few grain floaties come out, but I just use a filter funnel on the boiler just to catch them. I also tilt the barrel towards the end if there is a bit of wash left, or the grain bed is lower.

    I remove the grey spent grains, then always chuck a bucket of water in with it and put the lid back on until l am ready with back set/sugar/top up grain. (keeps yeast happy?)

    I have not added any extra yeast for at least a year if not longer, its not needed as the generations continue. Only once in 2 years did I "think" I got an infection, so chucked everything out, cleaned and started fresh, but used half the grain bed from a second fermenter, again no yeast added.

    With the backset I only use the bare minimum to invert my sugar, the rest is clean water, this also gets me to around the correct temps without waiting to cool everything down,

    I have no idea how many generations I'm up to, some I run once a month, other times sits for ages before running

    fadge

  • Thank you fadge for that post. I can't wait to do a stripping run on the 40L I have and start the fermenters up again. I thought the same thing about using just enough backseat to dissolve the sugar and the remainder clean cool water to get to a good yeast temp for the grain bed. Do you age your end result? What method do you find works?

  • So FloridaCraker you add yeast when you add the backseat. If I just run the fermentation off the grain bed and it doesn't take can I then add yeast back in? Very helpful thanks!!

  • Read the thread mate, it will take off. I've had well over 100 generations off the same yeast and shared a cup of wash with a neighbour who's run just as many from the cup of wash. You only add yeast once.
    Use only 25% or less backset or the fermentation will slow down. Malt barley or rye work well in about 10-15% additions.

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  • @fadge & @punkin - what's your base yeast?

  • Mine is Danstil C, no longer in production under that name at least.

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  • edited March 2015

    After 100 generations it has mutated into a "house yeast" no doubt. Adapting itself to the local conditions.

    As the generations UJSM progress, the backset becomes... stronger (for lack of a better word). I have settled into using around 10% backset. Any more than that slows fermentation down. I believe there is some kind of yeast growth inhibitor (besides low pH) that cycles up in concentration as backset is reused over and over again.

    I go half corn and half pale ale malt in my UJSM. I scoop out around two cups of spent grains and replace them with a handfull each of new grains in each new generation (25L batches). Two 25L batches fit just right in my half barrel sanke keg boiler for a stripping run. Three strips of low wines diluted to around 30-35% fit nicely for a spirit run.

    I'm more like I am now than I was before.

  • edited March 2015

    @Unsensibel said: fadge & punkin - what's your base yeast?

    I recall just first batch was bakers yeast, one time I added back-set and sugar that was way too hot and it did not take off for 2 days,(killed yeast?) so I tossed a sachet of ec1118 and whisky 05 together between 2 x 60 lt batches and it kicked back in just fine. So its gota be a mongrel hybrid "fadge" strain by now.

    Grain bed now is very little crushed corn, then mostly wheat and barley, plus I now use malted grain and toss a can of liquid rye malt in perhaps every second wash, smells just like beer, tastes great off the stripping runs, spirit runs are still on dominoes, but I take a sample every once and a while!

    I'm seeking a whisky/light rye type drink more than bourbon, but my first 12 mths was 50% corn then wheat and barley, my bourbon mates love it, but I don't so they get a lot of freebies until the 100+ lts is gone!

    I reckon 3 or maybe 4 strip runs to each spirit run.

    Fadge

  • @Kdog said: So FloridaCraker you add yeast when you add the backseat. If I just run the fermentation off the grain bed and it doesn't take can I then add yeast back in? Very helpful thanks!!

    Only on the first original wash. I once felt like I might have burned the yeast with hot backset so I did add some more yeast. That was 2 or 3 generations ago.

  • I just did my first stripping run of the 10 gallons of wash. Had some difficulty racking the wash off the grain bed it was like a three stooges skit. What's the best way to drain the wash off the grains and yeast bed? I was trying to use an auto siphon and couldn't get it started and couldn't hold the hose on one end and get siphon started, shot wash all over my pants when it started then stopped lol.... It was an experience to say the least. So if any one has some detailed instructions for doing this better please help!

  • Well something simple.... tape your hose to a rod or stick and just barely keep the end off the grain/yeast bed... and maybe a tea ball over the end to keep the grain out... yeah yeah that's the ticket...

    have fun and happy stillin,

    FS :D

  • edited March 2015

    @Kdog said: ...shot wash all over my pants when it started then stopped lol.... It was an experience to say the least. So if any one has some detailed instructions for doing this better please help!

    I find it helps if you think about garbage or something really ugly while doing that... B-)

    I'm more like I am now than I was before.

  • edited March 2015

    image

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    I just turn the ball valve on and let it run into a bucket.

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  • When I used a siphon, I just had a cane shaped piece of copper pressed through a tight hole in a 1"x3"x24" board. I could slide the siphon up and down and the board rested across the fermenter. Once I got down near the grain bed, I slipped a kitchen strainer under the bottom of the siphon and pressed the strainer into the grain bed to get most of the liquid out. I also mesh bag over the opening of the boiler to catch any grain particles that got through the stainer. Insofar as starting the siphon, fill it with water and hold it in with your thumbs until you're ready to go. It took a few tries to get good at it.

    Now, my fermenter has a bulkhead an inch or so off the bottom with a screen attached inside. I have a stainless steel ball valve on the outside and a tube goes to the boiler for filling. I still use a mesh stainer bag over the boiler fill-port just in case. And I built a small work bench style table for the fermenter to sit so that gravity does the work.

  • I use a syphon hose , the the hose has a piece of copper pipe clamped to the end of it. The pipe supplies enough weight to the end of the hose to keep it on the bottom, or just on top of the grain depending how you want to look at it. The copper pipe has very fine stainless mesh clamped over the end of it, this keeps any grains from entering the hose and ending up in the boiler. You can get fine stainless mesh from a kitchen sieve or strainer. Use stainless hose clamps. Helps if the copper pipe has a 90 degree bend in it so that it lays flat on top of the grain.

  • I use a little aquarium pump and a length of 1/2" hose to pump over to the boiler. A kitchen sieve on the port to catch any grains.
    Then I just hold the pump just below the surface until it gets to the bottom and switch off.

  • I have a drain about 5 inches from the bottom of my tank with a long filter screen on the inside. I drain and then cold crash in the fridge. Most yeast is below the drain but the crashing settles the rest.

  • All great ideas! Thanks everyone. I can see there is a learning curve :D

  • @Kapea said: I find it helps if you think about garbage or something really ugly while doing that... B-)

    That's some funny shiz!!!

  • @fadge said: Grain bed now is very little crushed corn, then mostly wheat and barley, plus I now use malted grain and toss a can of liquid rye malt in perhaps every second wash, smells just like beer, tastes great off the stripping runs, spirit runs are still on dominoes, but I take a sample every once and a while!

    Are you getting much sugar from the malted grains? What type of sugar you using?

  • @punkin said: I've had well over 100 generations off the same yeast

    What type of sugar do you use punkin? Do you age and how?

  • edited March 2015

    @Kdog said: Are you getting much sugar from the malted grains? What type of sugar you using?

    I don't mash the grain, its for flavor only.
    I do how-ever have the fresh dry grain mix in a tub and add boiling hot backset to it and let it sit for 15-30mins while I get everything else organized.
    Sugar is just plain old sugar nothing fancy, cheapest in the supermarket, home brand or generic.

    My ferments tend to sit for 3-4 weeks on average before I run, I don't have a filter on my 1/2" tank fitting and 1/2" tap, hardly never gets blocked, but I always use a filter funnel on the boiler to trap the few floaties that get in the buckets. I don't siphon.

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    fadge

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  • edited March 2015

    I use raw sugar. CSR :: Raw Caster Sugar

    It has some molasses still in it and is less refined.

    I age in 50l toasted barrels for around 3 years and then finish in a 10l stainless barrel on dominoes in a solera style.

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  • @punkin said: I age in 50l toasted barrels for around 3 years and then finish in a 10l stainless barrel on dominoes in a solera style.

    Is it pretty smoothed out after that 3 years? What would you compare it to quality wise?

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