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- BenStiller January 2015
- CothermanDistilling January 2015
- FloridaCracker January 2015
- grim January 2015
- jbierling January 2015
- jonno January 2015
- Lloyd January 2015
- luckyliqueur January 2015
- Myles January 2015
- punkin January 2015
- rossco January 2015
- shindig January 2015
- Smaug January 2015
- TheMechWarrior January 2015
- unsub January 2015
Dash or Crystal Dragon?
If you were to do it all over again would you buy a Dash or Crystal Dragon System and why.
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I am going to buy a Dash. Lloyd knows why but I am not telling.
If it wasn't for my specific requirements I would probably go for a Crystal Dragon though. Plates are the same so it is probably just a choice of which you like the most.
I have been debating this exact question myself. I am going to buy one or the other this Spring and can't seem to decide. I will probably go with the Dash because I am prone to breaking things. I am also looking at long term; Let's say 20 years from now I break a glass column and SD has moved on to bigger and better things (hope not). I really love the visual spectacle of the CD. I'll probably make the decision on the way down there to pick it up (I live a couple of hours from the warehouse). Either way, it is a win/win.
When i get asked this i have a couple of points of difference that i point out. These may or may not apply to you.
The Crystal Dragon is shorter. That means for any given head space you csn fit more plates or more packed sections in.
The Crystal Dragon is visually just stunning. You have to see one set up to fully grasp how good these units look. People who have never seen a still just stand there with their jaw dropped.
I could not bring myself to part with them once setup for photos.
The CD is a better choice for commercial operations where tours will be important to them. It is so easy to understand what's going on from a safe distance and you can see it from across the room as a group when i is operating.
The Dash is possibly possessing of more longevity. As said above if anything happened to your lenses you would rely on us stocking them again or getting more hand made custom somewhere. The Dash tees will last forever and although our tees are built to our specs and are superior to standard tees, standard tees will work. You just won't be able to see the plates very well.
The stainless look appeals to some people. Simple as that.
The Dash could be considered as more easily configurable. Although as Sadi has shown with his pics of the CD you can pull plates out easily from the CD plate tree, the Dash lends itself to adding or removing a plate very easily, by removing the plate or the whole tee.
As far as operation goes, they both have the same internals, with the only possible difference being the minute chance of increased entrainment if the CD is driven extremely hard.
The real choice you are yet to make is between Procaps and regular caps :)) :D
StillDragon Australia & New Zealand - Your StillDragon® Distributor for Australia & New Zealand
I was under the impression that the pro caps were more for 5" and up. Also that it would take more power to run vs bubble caps. Where did I get that and is there anything to it? I know that it has probably been beaten to death, but what ARE the pros and cons of the two caps?
Punkin broke it down very well.
It does not take MORE power to run ProCaps but they can easily cope with more power.
If you plan on using a 4" diameter only, then the original bubble cap design is the best value on the planet.
StillDragon North America - Your StillDragon® Distributor for North America
I've found immediate access to each plate in my 8" Dash to be invaluable. Without that I would have needed to take the whole thing down for cleaning way more often than I'd like.
Understood as I think that they both are great values, but what is the benefit of one cap over the other, price not withstanding?
I'm completely comfortable with either glass or stainless steel. Regular or ProCaps. Baby Dragon to 5".
A Dash is far easier to assemble and disassemble but filming a video of a Dash in operation cannot capture the attention that the Crystal Dragon does.
I guess if no one will ever see it except you, the Dash would probably be best as its bulletproof. If you want to awe your friends and family I'd say the CD would be the ticket.
Imagine small stills 5 or even 3 years ago. There were so few choices then compared to now. Pot still, packed column (VM) or Boc head packed column (LM). And that was about it.
Fast forward 20 years and who knows what the possibilities will be... anti-gravity vapor disbursement with ion spectrometer stabilizers :D
I would get a dash for your first one, then if you want to make a spirit only still, the CD is nice to watch... but not fun to take apart and clean, which you will have to do each time your boiler has anything but clear liquid in it... If Dunedin (Tampa) is not too far of a drive for you, I can let you touch both, I have 4 dash sections with a 4-plate CD on top of them.
The procaps can be driven harder to boost output rate without hurting quality further than anything else on the market. If you don't have the power available to run them to their potential you may well be better off staying with regular caps (unless you buy 5" and then it's auto procaps) and saving some money.
StillDragon Australia & New Zealand - Your StillDragon® Distributor for Australia & New Zealand
In theory because each ProCap incorporates its own downcommer, any size plate will have more downcommer area than the equivalent plate with regular caps. This gives you the potential to run the plate at a higher power level. Does not mean that you have to do so, just you are able to do so.
cotherman- Why would you have to clean the CD more often than the Dash?
I would go for the Dash because as FloridaCracker said: I am prone to breaking things.
you have to clean a still used on a non-clear boiler charge way more often..., you can take a dash down to 2 plates to speed up a strip, and it disassembles.. actually, it reassembles quicker and perfectly each time without adjustments.... if you really want a crystal and not a dash, then potstill all your ferments...
I will have a 4" Dash or CD on top of a converted 15.5 gal keg. Heating is done by a ULWD 5500 heating element. I run 12 gallons per run. Could I use pro caps?
What about putting an 8" ball valve at the base ( between the boiler and the first plate) and closing it to flood the column with cleaning solution? Then you don't have to take anything apart :) Just put something at the top of the column that allows you to hook up a hose.
Like an pipe expansion plug with a hose fitting installed in it, or an inflatable pipe plug (would require another fitting)?
Why chose when you can have both for a relatively small extra cost (applies to 4" model only)?
I use both configurations. Dash is great for the extra weight of a gin basket.
Yes. Power level for a 4" column (assuming that is what you are talking about) is usually tween 2400 and 3600 watts with regular caps. 5500 watts will give you a lot of room to play with Procaps. It would also allow you to run a 5" column if shortened run times are one of your goals.
StillDragon Australia & New Zealand - Your StillDragon® Distributor for Australia & New Zealand
also, with our cooling water temps, a 2nd 2" x 20" condenser is worth every penny... and maybe the super dephleg.
I planned on getting the super dephleg because of that reason. Just upgraded my cooling system to a 275 gallon tote. Ran my rig for 6 hours on a spirit run Saturday and the temp of the water went up 10 degrees. A lot better than the 55 gallon tank that I was using. The main problem I have with my reflux column now is that the condenser is WAY too small/short. If I try to push the power much over 55 on the controller, I get hot distillate and or alc vapor. The positive thing is that I get about 90 ABV. The negative is that I can't get much lower to save flavors. I have no problem keeping the column in full reflux but can't run very fast.
By my calculations, it would cost approx an extra $560 for 4 4" sight towers, right?
How fast are you trying to run Florida?
No real set speed but 6 hours for a spirit run is longer than I want to go.
@FloridaCracker a bigger or even bespoke condenser is a relatively cheap investment considering what you already have?
I don't know the specifics of your rig to advise but I'd suggest you contact your local SD supplier to go over your requirements.
From reading between the lines I'm guessing 4"?
If this is the case how much power are you trying to throw at this thing? It may be a simple case of reality check?
For a comparison, and my rig is nothing like yours (apple v orange) I do a spirit run at 4,800W on a 6" rig. I could go faster but that's the speed I choose. So by my inebriated estimates you would/should be running at no more than 2,200W. IF you have Procaps you could run higher.
Mech out.
Warrior, I have a homemade rig from the '90's that I am still using/suffering with. Gonna trade it out for a Dash or CD this spring. This one has 3 1/2" tubes in the lower half of the column for reflux. The lines obviously aren't hooked up in this pic but you get the idea. The design was obviously meant to be in a colder climate with colder water. The condenser needs to be at least twice as long. Puts out some killer whiskey but is fairly limited
You only need one sight tower that you extend with glass sections (42$ for two sections) and CD gaskets (8$ each) so about 250$ for 4 plates + rods and bolts to hold everything together.
@FloridaCracker, my condolences...I haven't seen one like that in many years. You'll be very happy with a 4" Dash or Crystal Dragon; just remember to grab a packed section if you want to also make neutral or do any rectification work.
Ben, this is what I was adding up; Sight glass tower $140, chimneys $84, gaskets $32, copper plates $36, caps and downcomers $172, rods and bolts $90 for a total of $554. What am I missing