StillDragon® Community Forum

Welcome!

Be part of our community & join our international next generation forum now!

In this Discussion

MOCS 4 Inch Crystal Modified BOK Build

Ok so I split this off from my post as this will be documenting the journey from prototype, build, assembly and testing my vision of a Crystal BOK.

After posting the question was I crazy or what, the crazies had it but with that said it was stated that I would be doing the organization a service if I did in fact do the build only to have it pale (feeble and unimpressive) in comparison to a 4 inch CM bubble plate design. So never being one to back down from a challenge and the fact that the only still I have ever run besides a pot still is LM Nixon Stone offset head still, I dubbed myself post child for this great endeavor and set a lofty goal of getting it to produce 9 to 10 liters per hour. =)) :-j 8-}

Well after spending a fist load of cash, machining and fabrication I now find myself at the assemble stage of things. Now the things you may or may not care about, first if this was going to work I needed to update my boiler as all I had was a 16 gallon keg boiler, so I ordered and received this shiny new 200 liter gem from @Smaug.

image

Why the 200L instead of 120L because for an extra 100.00 bucks I would be a fool not too, although unlike @Drunkas mine arrived on an open pallet so there was no envisioning a beautiful woman being tucked inside of a create, however it was a beautiful moment just the same.

The next was to prototype a collar design that could incorporate the slant collection cup and drain but believing that the slant plates actually hinders the vapor speed as it rises to the condensing coil, I chose to modify one of Alex's other designs the mushroom head. I about fell off my chair when @Myles posted the same drawing on the crazy or what post I had been referencing for my design but then I realized that just maybe I might just be on to something here, or was that on something I can never remember which but all are good. So with out further ado for the for time posted anywhere (accept when I showed @Lloyd when I was visiting him in China and @dad) I give you the Crystal Dragon BOK Prototype Collar! (patent pending)

image

Now this was only assembled so I could test the stepper take off valve, the placement of the RTD for reading vapor temps and the collection cup size as I envision all of these will be modified as test runs dictate and more is learned, here is a pic of the shell of the column mounted on the keg boiler.

image

For now this is all I have to offer you in the way of pics of the still but as things progress this week I will try to post daily but I am still waiting on my reducer from my buddy who's welding the 4 inch flange to the 8 inch machined end cap this may take a couple of days as he's swamped at work. The column can be arranged in a number of configurations from perf plates, regular bubble cap to the ProCap version and yes even CM as I purchased all the parts this way I can offer a fair comparison. However the first run however will be with what I know best, a packed column with SPP which I made myself on this contraption.

image

It makes beautiful SPP like this;

image

image

This SPP was scaled for this column you will notice the smaller SPP in comparison to the bigger one they fill my 2 inch column and the spring it is cut from, here is what it looks like close up in the column;

image

Well enough for one post, @moonshine is probably going to have my hineder for so many pics in one post and Lord help me I hope there in the correct size so I'll just say I'm sorry now for my miss givings.

MOCS

1.jpg
600 x 800 - 81K
2.jpg
800 x 600 - 82K
3.jpg
600 x 800 - 78K
4.jpg
600 x 800 - 88K
5.jpg
600 x 800 - 114K
6.jpg
800 x 600 - 92K
7.jpg
600 x 800 - 112K

The day you quit learning is the day you start dying!

"I am an incurable gadgeteer, and I like enormously to set up a theory and then track down the consequences" Murray Leinster youtube.com/watch?v=08e9k-c91E8

«134

Comments

  • Excellent post MOCS, keep it coming!
    I don't really understand the BOK Prototype Collar but I probably will as this thread develops.

  • +1 on Lloyd's comment. More pics! @Moonshine likes em just as much as we do :D

  • edited October 2014

    Wow, I'd love to see more pictures of the internals there.

    You planning on using a standard dephlegmator as your condenser (or even a product condenser mounted up top)?

    How big is your stepper valve? That monster looks like it could move some serious volume.

  • @Lloyd , @captainshooch, @grim thank you for your words of encouragement, I have been planning and working on this since last January unfortunately the four letter work has really slowed this build, since the start of the year I have been home a total of 65 days so when you take out the undivided Mrs's time it has only left about 40 days of fab time and my machine shop (brother in-law) is 3 hrs north of my house.

    Thank you @Moonshine I see that you have tidied up my pics if you were able to provide a Mac tutorial I will do my best to try and resize them before posting.

    @grim internal pics are coming, the condenser will have 2 options first will be a double coil helix design which is fab'd out of 1/2 inch Gastite CSST when you see the pic you will notice that the coil is bronze or goldish in color this is due to the fact that Gastite anneal's the SS tube, I choose this material as it is easier to form tighter radius's with, I used 14 feet of tubing to form the coil. I also have a standard 4 inch Dephleg which is available too if I so choose, I went with the standard 4 inch as I will be applying cooling management via a 16000 BTU Webasto heat pump system which I am waiting on so I felt there no need for a super Dephleg.

    The Stepper valve during static testing has proven to be a disappointment as the flow rates are to low for my application, this may change when the still is under power and may provide some although minimal pressure and the manufacture is working with me to change the volume of flow as it's application is for air. However my backup valve will work but is not as compact and pretty, it is a HOKE VALVE # 2335F4Y 316 SS which will be setup with a nema 23 stepper motor. This option is still a WIP but the Arduino program is ready for controlling it but in the short term will be controlled manually via a micrometer handle and offers a Cv of 0.012.

    My condensing coil should be assembled today and I will trying to post a pic tonight.

    The day you quit learning is the day you start dying!

    "I am an incurable gadgeteer, and I like enormously to set up a theory and then track down the consequences" Murray Leinster youtube.com/watch?v=08e9k-c91E8

  • Ah wtf I want more. Hurry up and get it made Im sitting on the edge my seat man.
    Nice work mate.

  • @Manofconstantsorrow said: Thank you Moonshine I see that you have tidied up my pics if you were able to provide a Mac tutorial I will do my best to try and resize them before posting.

    No worries, I'm always here to clean up and fix things on a daily bases whenever I pass by. I can't really give you any advice on how to prepare pics on a Mac, I can only guess that you have a picture manipulation software install. They key to proper pics on a forum (not only here, but anywhere else as well) are downsizing to 800x600 / 600x800 pixel (4:3 / 3:4; 16:9 is discouraged, the larger side should be 800 anyway) and even more importantly to use a JPEG quality setting of 80% when saving (that setting has the largest influence on file size).

    I know that sounds too technical for most folks here, so again, don't worry and post pics as you are comfortable with, I'll check it all anyway to keep our forum in the best shape with the shortest page loading times possible.

    Your Place to be >>> www.StillDragon.org <<< Home of the StillDragon® Community Forum

  • Looks great mate. You've certainly set your self a challenge at 9-10l/hr of aezeotrope. hard to tell the column diameter from the pics, but looking at it on the little keg, i'm guessing 4"?

    I can get 4.5l/hr from my 3" VM, but it's a bit dirty.

    StillDragon Australia & New Zealand - Your StillDragon® Distributor for Australia & New Zealand

  • Ok so todays update but to answer @punkin question first, yes you are correct in your assumption the column diameter is in fact 4 inch and thanks for the kind words.

    So today I received the pump for the cooling management system, it is a Pan World magnetic water pump model number 40PX, here are the specs; Max Flow: 480gph, Max Head: 13.5ft, Power: 45W

    Fittings (Inlet/Outlet): 3/4" MPT / 3/4" MPT, Dimensions (L x W x H): 8" x 4" x 4", Comparable to Iwaki: 20RLT and here is what she looks like;

    image

    image

    Also got a pic of the Webasto heat pump which is to ship tomorrow;

    image

    Now on to the BOK condenser, the chimney measures 12 inches, this was fab'd along with the other glass except for the 4 inch sections I bought from SD, I had the ends of all the fab'd glass flame hardened;

    image

    Next are pics for the condenser coil which was described in a previous post earlier in this thread;

    image

    image

    image

    The tubes are connected to an 4 inch end cap via swagelok 1/2 inch bulkhead fittings;

    image

    image

    And here is what it looks like when it all comes together, I present to you the Modified Crystal BOK condenser head;

    image

    image

    image

    image

    image

    Well tomorrow is another day, hope you enjoy the pics. Hoping the low profile 8 X 4 reducer get finished tomorrow and I can start assembling the still on the boiler.

    Thanks for having a look.

    MOCS

    1.jpg
    800 x 600 - 88K
    2.jpg
    600 x 800 - 57K
    3.jpg
    800 x 450 - 58K
    4.jpg
    600 x 800 - 81K
    5.jpg
    800 x 600 - 85K
    6.jpg
    800 x 800 - 66K
    9.jpg
    800 x 800 - 58K
    7.jpg
    800 x 800 - 112K
    8.jpg
    600 x 800 - 55K
    11.jpg
    600 x 800 - 89K
    13.jpg
    600 x 800 - 99K
    12.jpg
    600 x 800 - 90K
    14.jpg
    600 x 800 - 99K
    10.jpg
    600 x 800 - 102K

    The day you quit learning is the day you start dying!

    "I am an incurable gadgeteer, and I like enormously to set up a theory and then track down the consequences" Murray Leinster youtube.com/watch?v=08e9k-c91E8

  • Damn!

    That's NICE. So many pretty things to look at.

  • Really nice condenser sir. Thanks for sharing.

  • edited October 2014

    My oh My.... please please add this to the SD collection!! You sir are a genius of styling!!

  • Sweeet ! MOCS I might have some of my glass sections hardened on the ends as well. Seems like that's where they tend to chip. Great pictures!! :-bd

    I run March 815PL pumps, but nowhere near the flow capacity of yours. Curious to see what the rate will be when it is all plumbed in. Is the price compatible or are they more than the March's?

  • That is a nice condenser!, I think we do need to come up with a visible condenser...

    kinda like the visible wankel:

    image

    or the visible V8:

    image

    visible_wankel.jpg
    500 x 450 - 28K
    visible_v8.jpg
    443 x 443 - 45K
  • The flamed ends and a 2-3x tall glass section would really be a welcome addition...

    Oh, and my 2 entries for the visible reflux condenser design contest that @Lloyd is about to start are here.

  • So nice MOCS.

    Is that heat pump/chiller from Henry?

    StillDragon North America - Your StillDragon® Distributor for North America

  • Nice work!! What size tank and what temps are you trying to maintain with the webasto?

  • edited October 2014

    Those pan-world pumps are great, blue line I believe is another option, both much less expensive than Iwaki. In my reef aquarium days I ran quite a few of those pumps, you could beat on them to no end.

  • Beautiful work there Mocs!

  • Wow, I am overwhelmed by the kind words and support for this build and I thank you all!

    So on with todays questions;

    @captainshooch said: Sweeet ! MOCS I might have some of my glass sections hardened on the ends as well. Seems like that's where they tend to chip. Great pictures!! :-bd

    I run March 815PL pumps, but nowhere near the flow capacity of yours. Curious to see what the rate will be when it is all plumbed in. Is the price compatible or are they more than the March's?

    I agree it would be a step up if @Lloyd were able to convince the vendor to flame the ends, it actually provides so many benefits; It anneals the glass relieving the stress from cutting, while sealing the edge protecting from chipping and actually helps to the strengthen the section.

    As for the pump differences; when you look at the flow curves for both pumps they are pretty much identical except the March has a higher head lift of 18' vs 13' @ 60 hz, Temp range March 250F vs 160F, price March 161.00 + shipping vs 130.00 free ship

    @captainshooch, now since my cooling management is a WIP I have some questions for you, I see you use flow meters for controlling your coolant flow, does the pump stall when you limit the flow to Dephleg or do you have a by pass so as not to build pressure and have you posted your flow control here so I may have a peak at it?

    Next question please;

    @Smaug said: So nice MOCS.

    Is that heat pump/chiller from Henry?

    @Smaug, yes this is from Henry he has been working to set up a system with a controller which will allow me to adjust the temp via a digital controller, he has been testing and thinks he has a good setup which he is hoping to ship today or tomorrow.

    @cunnyfunt said: Nice work!! What size tank and what temps are you trying to maintain with the webasto?

    @cunnyfunt For now I plan on using a 55gal poly barrel, as for temp the system in theory should allow me to control the temp anywhere from 60F to 90F, I know a 70F is best for a LM but since I will be new to CM I wanted some adjustment.

    @grim said: Those pan-world pumps are great, blue line I believe is another option, both much less expensive than Iwaki. In my reef aquarium days I ran quite a few of those pumps, you could beat on them to no end.

    @grim, I think I made the right decision here but only running will confirm it.

    Well waiting on todays deliveries so the Mrs's is requesting 2 hours of my help in house cleaning so I better get to work so I can get back to cutting SPP. Note to self; next time get automated cutter finished before running SPP idiot! as it take 1.25 hours to dice up a 30 foot strand which is about 3 inches in a 4 inch column. No worries only another 30 inches of column of SPP cut.

    Thanks again, MOCS

    The day you quit learning is the day you start dying!

    "I am an incurable gadgeteer, and I like enormously to set up a theory and then track down the consequences" Murray Leinster youtube.com/watch?v=08e9k-c91E8

  • @Manofconstantsorrow no MOCS the march pumps do not stall so no bypass required. I can only get about 1.2 to 1.4 L/min max flow but I have a lot of head and also return thru a car radiator that fills from the bottom and dumps from the top to which adds even more restriction. With one standard deph (sometimes I used two inline for the ProCap CD) I find around 0.3 to o.4 L/Hr is the right amount of cooling flow for a run with reservoir temps in the mid to upper 20C's (summer time) and less flow in winter( arouun 0.2 L/Hr). I hope this helps
    I also built a manifold to be able to run 2 pumps if needed.

    image

    pumps.jpg
    600 x 800 - 82K
  • The flow control box info is scattered all over, bits here and there. I can gather up a list and schematic if you'ld like but @CothermanDistilling sourced some flow meters with remote sensors that might be a better option.
    I basically use an SD needle valve and Digiflow meters.

  • I think you are going to need a bigger coolant tank, how many btu is that chiller?

  • Mocs have a look here

  • Hey mocs I goofed the first post should be in GPM, not liters he he he. You prolly figured that by now. all my numbers are in GPM.

  • I have been using a corrugated ss deflagmator for a couple of years ... you will be amazed at how well it works... I also use the ss tubing in my final condenser...

    Great Job MOCS.. :-bd

  • @captainshooch thanks for the insight, too many things on the plate right now to start on flow controller but when I get some down time I start planning it so I appreciate the info on the flow meters. That head height can be a killer it's difficult to find a good pump with low flow that doesn't get bogged down pushing to the heights we need. Cooling the Hoochinator must be a real bitch to keep flowing.

    @grim I'm hoping not as there's not much room left at the inn/shack, actually I believe I'll be ok as the Webastco is 16,000 BTU it going to be a learning curve to get the flow right, the system will have two temp monitoring points to help with compressor pressures it will just take a little time to get her down so the system doesn't freeze up. I leaning on Henry's experience here so as soon as I have it in hand and get it running all be posting the results.

    The day you quit learning is the day you start dying!

    "I am an incurable gadgeteer, and I like enormously to set up a theory and then track down the consequences" Murray Leinster youtube.com/watch?v=08e9k-c91E8

  • Hey MOCS the Hoochinator is a breeze. Only one pump 0.4 GPM on the Deph and 1.0 GPM on the condenser. Is the rigs with the ProCaps, where I use 2 dephs and 2 condensers that are a bit more demanding but even then I can get by with just one pump because of less head I suppose.

  • @captainshooch said: Is the rigs with the ProCaps, where I use 2 dephs and 2 condensers that are a bit more demanding but even then I can get by with just one pump because of less head I suppose.

    @captianshooch, is because you have to throw so much power at the ProCap to operate that it requires this much cooling? I was with @Lloyd when he did the run for the adjustable down comer and he just ran one dephleg.

    Thanks @FullySilenced the CSST condenser sure look pretty can't with to see it in action.

    The day you quit learning is the day you start dying!

    "I am an incurable gadgeteer, and I like enormously to set up a theory and then track down the consequences" Murray Leinster youtube.com/watch?v=08e9k-c91E8

  • The procaps don't require any more heat than the originals. They can certainly take more though.

    StillDragon North America - Your StillDragon® Distributor for North America

  • @Smaug when I was running ProCaps with @Lloyd he actually had to up the power by 25% I believe to get all the trays to load correctly over his normal run but then again he was feeding me that bijou bourbon he makes and I could be mistaken.

    The day you quit learning is the day you start dying!

    "I am an incurable gadgeteer, and I like enormously to set up a theory and then track down the consequences" Murray Leinster youtube.com/watch?v=08e9k-c91E8

Sign In or Register to comment.