Setup for a Whiskey Still?

Flokks

Hi everybody,

I'm looking for a setup that imitates a Scottish whiskey still and wondering how I could build it using StillDragon parts.

Would it "just" be tri-clamp pipe after the boiler with copper added, and then a 90 + 45 degree bend to get the lyne arm angle before adding the condenser?

Thank you in advance,
Flokks

Lloyd

In the secret back room of all the big Scottish distilleries is a SD Dash =))

Just joking, of course.
@Flokks you seem to have a handle on it already. They use the simplest of pot stills but because of the huge (often more than 20,000L) size they use a lyne which has very limited value on a tiny (1000L or less) size still. At our size of 50 to 100L the lyne arm has very little effect at all.

Its really just a simple pot still but as you scale up very small changes have effects that smaller stills just can't notice.

To be truly authentic the still needs to be very, very simple. Rampant smearing of heads and tails into the hearts cut is needed to draw out the flavors over years in an old oak barrel.
I fear its less about the still than it is the peated malt, the cuts taken, the condition of the barrel and the number of years that it is buried away - then blended with other such barrels from other regions from other distilleries. Every step could have a big book written about it.

I'd go with a TC pipe connected to the boiler with copper scrubbies very loosely packed, a 45 angled either up or down (your choice as the lyne angle seems to have the most passive reflux effect), a pipe section to get the parrot away from the still (the actual "arm") and whatever fittings you need from there to connect to your condenser.

Ain't no right or wrong, just what tastes best to you.

Flokks

Thanks Lloyd, great answer.

I would actually like to remove some of the heads and tails. From what ive read the majority of the flavor comes from the cask. Wouldnt mind less of a hangover :)

Would it be possible to add a ProCap plate to the TC pipe setup and still get flavor through?

Regards Flokks

Myles

There seem to be a few folks that operate 1 or 2 plates in a pot still mode to get a bit of heads and tails definition.

1 way seems to be to use a dephlegmator to initially load the plates, and then to switch off the cooling, and run as if it were a pot still. However there is a huge amount of versatility available in HOW you run the rig and no right or wrong answers.

As far as configuration goes I always suggest this. Start with your product condenser. Position it so that it is convenient for collecting the product. Then work backwards to the boiler to make everything fit. Riser height, arm length etc are all just matters of convenience in stills this size.

Lloyd

Yep, you could but it would not be "die hard" Scottish and not a simple pot still.

We have known for quite some time that any bubble column can give you anything that you want. It is a simple matter of collecting in small fractions (collecting in small cups) and blending the desirable ones together (or PARTS of the desirable ones together is probably more precise). That blending is by far the most artisan part of distilling.

To avoid the headaches we discard the first and the last and keep the middle. That axiom takes a lot of experience to perfect. Even the frugal Scots don't barrel the fores, early heads and middle-to-late tails.

To better answer your question, bubble cap plates by their nature are prone to increasing the alcohol by volume while carrying over flavor. That's why it takes so many bubble plates (usually 20 or more) to get to a flavorless vodka. One plate will carry over TONS of flavor. Two plates only a ton. Ten plates only a pound. Twenty plates an ounce or two....etc...

DistilliTraK

I have been using my SG with 3 plates in my SF whiskey runs. Matter of fact, It improved the quality of the recipe twofold as I get exactly what is being discussed above. Good flavor, excellent control and I get better separation of the factions. And it doesn't take me 8 hours either! I use the method Myles speaks to, but I leave it in balance for about 45 mins to an hour as described in the SDragon operations guide, and then let it go to town..

JoeHell

Maybe?

punkin

If you have a look on the potstill section of the Australian site you'll see this one. It's exactly what's being described here...

http://www.stilldragon.com.au/potshot-2-option-2-potstill/

A lot of people add a babycondensor before the bends and a couple of Torpedos on the bottom to create what Myles has talked about, that would be the most popular potstill i sell.

http://www.stilldragon.com.au/torpedo-2-4-bubble-section-complete/

CothermanDistilling

get some really wide radius 90's and make it circle the column.... for balance and beauty

Flokks

You guys are just awesome :).

And JoeHell thats a beautiful piece of kit.

The dephlegmator route is to get better initial separation before running it like a potstill?

Smaug

Yes Flokks. You can even simply allow a very small measure of circulation with no 100% reflux period at all. Then simply think like a potstiller and run like a potstiller. By doing this you will still get a goodly measure of heads and tails compression but not so much that your whiskey is insipid. Your product will be on par with double run with more yeild.

Myles

@CothermanDistilling said: get some really wide radius 90's and make it circle the column.... for balance and beauty

Hah! If you are going to do this then you really NEED a coiled liebig. I have a 7 foot long 3 core version but there are a few others in use by some other folks also. ;)

Flokks

Myles can we see the coiled liebig? :)

Im not sure I want a column enveloped in pipe. But I do like the looks of the classic alembics.

Its just a nice shape and a pretty condensor :)
Flokks

JoeHell

@Flokks said: You guys are just awesome :).

And JoeHell thats a beautiful piece of kit.

The dephlegmator route is to get better initial separation before running it like a potstill?

That's the idea, though I haven't put it to the test yet

Myles

Coiled Liebig. Outer coiled jacket is about 11" in diameter and it contains 3 sets of 3/8" vapour paths in the same jacket. The spacer rods between the coils may be removed later once the jacket coil stiffens into position.

I already had the 1" copper coil, so just had to insert the inner cores. The 3 cores join in a manifold into a 3/4" tube on both the vapour in and product out ends.

CothermanDistilling

that is fucking beautiful

Moonshine

Clearly, @Myles is THE copper artist! :-bd

CothermanDistilling

Hmmmm... make @Myles creation that can fit around an 8" CD?????

grim

Are you plumbing that into a reservoir or do you think you have enough btu to cool directly?

Myles

Easy to build a coiled liebig in any size. The only problem is if you wish to use a copper jacket for aesthetics. ;)

CothermanDistilling

the big one will sit under the chiller and complete the refrigeration loop (chiller came with refrigerant lines cut (there is no pump or reservoir in this chiller) and with a pump, recirc to the IBC tote full of water. I could possibly see mounting a smaller tank underneath it for glycol, but since I am going to cool the water to 70, not 40 or even 35F, I don't have to worry about freezing like I would in a brewery glycol chiller.

timsky

Thanks for the posts everyone. So just to confirm, running a SD dash 1 with two plates will carry tons of flavour for all grain whiskeys which is great. Use the depleg only to load the plates, then turn off to only use the product condenser. Collect various fractions eg 85-90%abv, 80-85, 75-80 etc. How far into the hearts do you collect? Stop at 40-45%? Does adding height via bubble tees without plates make a difference? Would appreciate advice on how to dilute to 45%. Just add distilled or filtered water and put on oak? Has anyone done any research on adding mineral water or varying water pH and its effects? Thanks Punkin and SD, seriously great gear. I'm so impressed with the engineering.

fadge

@timsky yep that's pretty much one way to run whiskey, it turns out well with lots of flavor carry over, starts maybe as high as 90% and goes down to whenever you decide to stop. I don't mind running that way.

But you just have to play around with different setups to see the various results. You can run 4 plates with deflag "running" and collect at 90% almost from start to finish, a more even product with a different flavor profile.

My last run was 3 plates, slow fores and heads about 1hr, then up the power for hearts at around 90% down to 85-80% or so, as soon as tails taste was noticeable, then deflag off double power for 15min and all done.

I reckon you cant really taste the fractions properly for a least a day or two of airing. Mostly cause every run I do, I'm having a taste or sample straight from the parrot, after a few of these tastes its all blending together on the tongue and distorts what I think is correct keepers and rejects. I do mark the jars I think are last heads, early tails, and compare a day or two later.

As for water, makes a lot of difference, wrong water can be cloudy sediment, tastes just not quite right etc. Some say spring water, but I'm not a fan, tested several brands with a couple of poor results. Being in au, I reckon if you can get 5lt "Moores" that's been good, but in my town they stopped selling it. I now get 10lt casks of "pureau", meant to be 100% guaranteed chemical free etc. I use this to bring product down to 65% for oaking and again when taking back down to 40% for storage and drinking.

My next purchase may be a small RO system, payback will be fairly quick. I do have a double filtered undersink and fridge water setup, but still go out and buy water, too much time and effort spent making booze to go and stuff it up at the end with crap water. IMO NEVER dilute with tap water.

We have several discussions on the site about water, if you want to have a quick search, some are within other topics I think.

As for adding extra tees for height, then it should not affect the product, but add the tee under the plates and you have a bit of headroom and protection from foam ups or poss flooding, as well as having the parrot at a level that may suit better.

Cheers

Fadge

timsky

Thanks heaps @fadge that's great info! Seriously, some collective genius on this forum!

punkin

I need to use deminarilised water from the ironing section of the supermarket or i get a sediment in my bottles. I still get the sediment sometimes, but not as bad.