Sizing a Coolant Reservoir

crozdog

I had a mate who had 5 x 1000l tanks of cooling water for his 500l still. He'd go through the lot on 1 run then in summer would have to wait days for it to cool enough to do another run. He ended up getting a fan coil unit that he mounted between the condenser hot outlet and the reservoir to drop as much heat out before it returned to the reservoir. He reckoned it made a big difference.

Br00ksy

@crozdog Yea I reckon that a radiator would help a heap in my circumstance

Had my chiller burst on me today I'm hoping it was an old hose internally that split

If not I have another 2 1500L tanks that I can daisy chain to my existing tank as extra thermal mass at ambient temperature

Started the sacrificial cleaning run today before the chiller broke with 1200L of water chilled to 17 degrees and after 3 hours it was up to 32 degrees by the time I shut down

Was planning to use the chiller feeding from the cold tank and into the cold water feed for the stills condensers.

I want to be able to handle all the elements the still has for cooling that way anything less is no big deal.

DonMateo

hey @brooksy. If your surname is Brook we could be related. My surname is Brook. My original ancestor to Australia was a convict called Richard Brook in 1850, although most of that part of the family live in Victoria.
On the ferments yes that was a lesson learnt the hard way. Good luck with the distillery mate. Its a tough industry and hard to get started. Although I really love the creation part of it. Oh yeh turning all six elements on is when you find out how good your electrical system is, or isnt. I found that out the hard way too.

Br00ksy

Yea my last name is Brooks

Going to give StillDragon America a call soon and ask them what they advise in flow rates and all my other questions

Cheers

DonMateo

@crozdog said: I had a mate who had 5 x 1000l tanks of cooling water for his 500l still. He'd go through the lot on 1 run then in summer would have to wait days for it to cool enough to do another run. He ended up getting a fan coil unit that he mounted between the condenser hot outlet and the reservoir to drop as much heat out before it returned to the reservoir. He reckoned it made a big difference.

I was thinking of buying one of those and I am probably going to do that as well as put in another 11000 litres.

Smaug

One of each

Br00ksy

Ah, so I'm guessing having 3000L wouldn't be sufficient @Smaug

I wanna throw some questions out there:

1. Would running 2 x 1500L vats daisy chained together at ambient temperature be enough mass to absorb a full 6 element stripping run? Pulling water from the front tank and pumping the hot return to the back tank?
2. Could a radiator of some kind on hot return from the still be advisable in the future? Likely to help a bunch?
3. Do you have any flow rate recommended specs for reflux condenser on 3,4 and 5 elements?
4. Typical run plan for the still? Set and forget the reflux flow rate after slow offtake to compress heads? Stick to controlling product output rate via power input adjustment?
5. The small metal tabs that come with the still... I have seen them attached to the bottom of plates in your YouTube videos. What do they do? Are they worth putting on if the column is already put together? Where should they be put on and orientated?

Smaug

1. As I recall, Citrus distillers used at one point an 800 gallon buffer tank and a 5 ton chiller and was generally satisfied on his 380L stripping runs. He would turn on the chiller the night before to ensure his reserve water was good and cold. I'm not sure sure how dumping your exit water back in to your buffer tank will affect the duration of the run? We really don't have the means to accurately determine the outcome beyond the anecdotal examples the guys here have discovered in practice. Even the chiller companies over shoot in order to cover their ass.
2. Absolutely helpful.
3. Flow rates would be predicated upon coolant temps. Too difficult to calculate with out stable temps.
4. For stripping only? Product out put will naturally slow down (and kettle temps will increase) once the system becomes depleted of alcohol. Increasing out put once depleted will significantly drop proof (if that matters to you).
5. We refer to those as Flow Directors. They are adjusted so the reflux does not dump immediately down the downcomer opening. doing so will promote smearing and also affect proof. Will the system work without them? Yes.

Was half way joking on the big water towers. But would also be an excellent way to advertise.

Can never have too much cooling capacity. It is the most overlooked.

Br00ksy

@Smaug Thanks mate :D Very very helpful

Will probably need a serious rethink of the cooling The cheapest thing I can do atm is plumb in radiators on the hot return and increase my coolant volume

CothermanDistilling

IMHO, slow is better if you have a water-air(radiator) outside cooling it before returning to the reservoir.. First, slower means longer contact time int he radiator/HX. Second, the higher temp going into the radiator is a larger delta-T for cooling and increases the efficiency of the radiator/HX. Third, the turnover of the reservoir is much, much slower. I use 2 24"x24" hx's for cooling 30l/hr or more of product through a PC.

Br00ksy

@CothermanDistilling Thanks mate

@Smaug

I feel dumb for asking this But what orientation should I have the plates?

Bubble caps up or down

Smaug

Caps on top side.

What bubble caps are you using? ProCaps with integrated downcomer? Or the original design with a stand alone downcomer?

Br00ksy

ProCaps

Br00ksy

For some reason I can't attach photos

I've put all the flow directors on the bottom of the ProCaps. 4 of the ProCaps have been flipped upside down to be used as down comers

Br00ksy

Like this

Photos weren't working from my phone

1st photo is how it would sit in the column

Smaug

Caps up. All oriented the same direction.

ProCaps have the integrated downcomer. The hole in the top of the cap is the downcomer.

Therefore there is a downcomer for every cap

Br00ksy

Ahhhhhhhhh

I see says the blind man

And for the flow directiors they just have to be pointed away from the caps below?

Smaug

The idea with the flow directors is that to the extent possible you want to prevent any liquid reflux from pouring down into any downcomer below. Doing so promotes smearing and also allows the column to loose production efficiency.

Just point the ones on the perimeter outward. And the interiors to dead center.