4" Crystal Dragon

Lloyd

The 4x4x3 Bubble Tee is 150mm tall (very close to 6 inches) as that is as short as we can make them with a 3" ferrule for the sight glass.
We also stock 4x4x2 Bubble Tees at 110mm by trading reduced height for a smaller sight glass.
All of the glass sections sizes are 100mm tall.
The standard SD 4" dephleg is 150mm tall.

@sandsquirt, the mold fee to produce the custom Crystal Dragon gaskets is a bit expensive. All resources are currently focused on building inventory to get us through the Chinese new year shutdown. I do foresee the CD gasket in 2" and 3" after then as it would complete the full range from 2 to 8". The 6" is up first and with luck it will be produced before the shutdown but may not make it on the ship in time. They may not appear until after CNY.

Moonshine

@Pretender, we refer to the stainless steel column as Dash and to a glass column as Sight Tower or Crystal Dragon (= CD), whereas SD is just the abbreviation for StillDragon.

sandsquirt

Thanks for the info. I will watch for them. Does that mean that you plan on having plates for a 3" in the future also?

punkin

I suspect the 2 and 3 inch would be released with the intention of them being used as packed sections. Glass sections could be 500mm long.

Pretender

Since I am interested in 4'' CD ask in this thread. Is the size of the output of the boiler does it matter? The films YT auważyłem that the output is 4'', but some users have in their boilerach out less, I think around 2''.

Smaug

The 2" outlet / column connection will work very well.

Pretender

Hi Smaug, That is enough to weld a "pipe" to the fitting section keg? Thank you very much for your reply, much can be learned in this forum. On my forum it is accepted, moreover, among the most moonshiners in my country, that the output of the boiler must be increased. That is, the column 50 is sufficient, but the greater is not. As you can see, however, "can"

Myles

Look at it this way pretender, if you increase the boiler output diameter all you really do is to produce the same volume of vapour but at a lower vapour speed. Your boiler has a limit to how much vapour it can produce and at max output the only thing that CAN change is the speed it leaves the boiler.

I suspect any sort of expansion space between the 2" boiler outlet and the bottom of whatever column you use would be sufficient. You have an expansion space there anyway, as you need a 4" to 2" reducer, so you are probably good to go.

You are not likely to run your column at max power anyway. That is more applicable to when you are doing a strip run. The logic behind using the bigger boiler outlet and tube in that scenario is actually more to do with reducing the vapour speed as it enters the condenser.

Pretender

I do not know whether I have translated and understood. At the exit of the keg is not much difference whether it is out 2'' or 4''. We speak of course of distillation. Regarding the strip run it is better to use a smaller output from the keg?

I understand?

punkin

It doesn'y matter. Vapour will just speed up to pass a short restriction.

Pretender

And everything is clear. No need to modify the keg.

Myles

@Pretender said: And everything is clear. No need to modify the keg.

WELL. Not strictly true. You can modify the keg opening for "bling" or "just because you can" but in practical terms the keg is good.
On a pot still it actually works in your favour to have an expansion space in the "helmet" of the still. The Cognac makers put a separate head space in there for a good reason.

Look at most traditional pot stills and the opening from the boiler into the headspace (or riser) is between 1/4 and 1/3 of the boiler diameter.

In a reflux still it is less.

Pretender

I am in the process of designing my boiler, so I'm looking for interesting but also practical solutions. Therefore, I ask to leave the boiler. What the creators of cognac, then guess what it is, but I do not know why this is done. I want a column in the style of the CD 4''. So I ask you to make out or just standard?

PS what is "bling"?

Stinger

@Pretender

Many commercial setups use wide boilers with wide openings, helmets, onions, gradually tapering vertical sections etc. to minimize the risk of entrainment where large volumes of vapour are released from the boiler at high speed. The reduced speed in that part of the still enables most/all? splashes of wash to return to the boiler, rather than be carried on up the vertical section of the still. A 6" (or longer) section of 4" tri-clamp pipe between the crystal dragon and a 2" x 4" reducer connected to the keg accomplishes this very effectively.

It might be an advantage to use some form of onion after your keg's 2" tri-clamp restriction with a pot still, but many/most? home-distillers are prepared to accept a slightly slower run in exchange for the saving of construction difficulty/time/cost and extra vertical still height that might be required.

Bling is a term used here for extra ornamentation/decoration/aesthetics NOT essential for the operation of the still.

Myles

:)) :)) Can't fault that decription of bling. A lot of us include stuff because we can. How it affects still operation is sometimes academic. Un-neccesary, probably - but included because we are able to do so.
I like to polish the brass connectors on my stills, but it does not change the product. Likewise the onion on my pot still, built partially to see if I could do it. If it does what I hoped and induces natural reflux all well and good. If not - well it is in keeping with the riveted copper seam theme of the still room. ;)

If I was building a Crystal Dragon I am sure I would include an extra section above the boiler but would probably fill it with sacrificial copper packing.

Pretender

@Stinger @Myles Thank you for the clarification. "Bling" - now I know :) In that case, my equipment will be the "BLING".

In that case, a specific question and a specific answer - whether the heating power of 4kW and column 4 "CD out of the keg increase or remain the standard output? If you increase it to how many?

@Myles Also plan to use the section filled with copper as a catalyst, but I wonder where to put it. If you will apply it at the bottom, at the very beginning, it will be in the rectification occurred. And I would not want to. I want to receive fruit distillates (this material in my neighborhood in abundance) and cereals, which are known to not be as "clean". Is the solution is to put a catalyst at the top, above the dephlegmator? Or is it better to put it on the bottom, and the condensate address without copper fill?

Bling :) my new favorite word :)

Myles

@Pretender. This is a good point that you need to be aware of. You will see many quoted power levels for columns. Many of these are calculated for the power input to the column. This is NOT the same as the power input to the boiler.

It is a small distinction but it could be important.

As for the copper catalyst my view on this is simple. On a plated column put it under the dephlegmator or under the column - which ever is convenient. However, on a packed column put it under the column.
If you put it under the dephlegmator / reflux condenser, the copper degrades and then falls into the packing causing potential problems later. If it falls into the boiler itself that is no problem at all.

Law_Of_Ohms

Put a lid on a boiling pot of pasta, watch it boil over, uncover lid a little, still boiling over? uncover lid more... no boil over...

IMO - outlet of get should be 4in for 4kw of heat, 2in is ok for 2400W

punkin

4kw should be just fine for the Crystal Dragon @Pretender, don't listen to @Law_Of_Ohms he is on drugs. We have just sorted the vapour speed issue.

I would recommend a controller so you can fine tune the power input.

Pretender

Approx. Unfortunately, I did not understand much about what's going on @Law_Of_Ohms. Example of pasta understood, but "... IMO - outlet of get Should be 4in for 4kW of heat, 2in 2400W is OK for ..." I do not know how to translate and understand: (sorry

@Myles thanks for the explanation. In that case, the catalyst lands under the column. What do you think 20cm will be enough? or maybe less? Or more?

I wanted to add that I have the power regulator, so I can control the power of the heaters correctly.

By asking the first question I wanted to know if the warming maximum power of 4 kW will use the full capacity 4 "CD and what it's all full size selection out of the keg.

PS if what I write, what I'm asking is for you to understand? I mean my English.

Myles

The copper is consumable, so you may need to replace it occasionally. I quite like the idea of being able to see the copper to monitor what condition it is in. I would just make a roll of copper mesh to fill 1 section of glass. 20 cm is probably more than you need. I think the copper mesh I got made a roll about 10 cm high.

Lloyd

@Pretender, if possible put a 6" ferrule on the top of your keg so you can get your arm inside to clean it out. Then a 6x4 reducer and you are good for a 4" column.
My fat arm will not fit inside a 4" ferrule.

You can follow my journey here in building what was to be my perfect keg boiler.

Pretender

At the moment, using the still pot in which the stainless steel tube is filled with copper springs. Springs are common, not as filling out a prism. It's easier and cheaper for me to get than copper wire mesh. The grid is very expensive, and besides, I'm afraid that it will be slightly breezy. Currently, in order to check the springs have to disassemble the machine. And by the glass will be seen on a regular basis.

@Lloyd, Thanks for the link. Already I take to be read.

captainshooch

Ran the 10 plate combo dash2 (5plate), crystal dragon (4plate), topped with a sight tower today and it went absolutely fantastic!! only used 13.5 amps on one 5500w element and the alcometer refused to float!!! stayed at 96-97 the entire run of the hearts (5.5 gals) and product temp was 27C . Following my original plan to do a strip thru 10 plates, then run only hearts a second time again thru 10 plates and ...ahhh!!! it works better than I could have ever imagined... @Lloyd you were absolutely right, it is amazing!!

RedDoorDistillery

Looks like with the Temp correction you were right at azeotrope. How did it taste? Even though you were pulling azeotrope it may not be neutral in flavor trying to go from wash to neutral.

Or was this your Spirits run after doing a strip run? What was your starting % in the boiler? Did you measure your takeoff rate?

captainshooch

@RedDoorDistillery 2 runs of 13 abv wash thru 10 plates then hearts only from previous 2 runs at 40ABV again thru 10 plates, this is only her third run and taste ,,, amazing, best I have ever made. Take off rate for me is always constant 3 L per hour or 20 minutes/quart give or take, not in a hurry :D

Lloyd

I am envious of the ceiling height of your shed.
Fantastic rig you have assembled @captainshooch.

captainshooch

@Lloyd Thanks! I am following your advise and it works, not that I had any doubts like some do, I do appreciate the years of experience you and SD forum has to offer and I intend to take full advantage of it :D

RedDoorDistillery

@captainshooch Cool that makes sense. Strip and then Spirits runs are the way to go when chasing neutral. Give a very nice product if you make good cuts. I also am envious of your ceiling height....

Moonshine

@captainshooch, beautiful setup, nice shed, nothing more to say. ;)