Good Whiskey at 94% ABV?

FloridaCracker

As if I don't already have enough trials going on (laugh) I thought that I would share my latest success with this forum.

Credit for all that I am about to pass along goes to Odin over on HD. Don't want to post a link but it would be easy to find if you try. Here's the gist and I apologize if this is well known here but I haven't come across it. A VERY flavorful whiskey can be obtained by running a still at vodka like numbers. We have all bought into the fact that running at high ABV will strip most flavors and in some instances it will but Odin's method carries over shitloads of flavor. I have personally done it and was shocked. Here's how he does it:

Run first run like normal. Take and discard fores. Collect and keep heads. Collect hearts at as high an ABV you can. Collect tails until vapor temp at top of column reaches about 82C. This first run is kind of like a sacrificial run; you are doing it to collect the feints (heads and tails). Keep the hearts for whatever.

The magic happens on the second run. Add wash/mash to the boiler AND add the feints from the previous run. Collect and discard fores. Collect heads and keep. Collect hearts AS HIGH AN ABV AS YOUR STILL WILL DO. Mine does azeo so that's what I did. Collect tails until vapor temp is 82 and keep. Keep feints for next run.

You will not believe how much flavor, smell carries over and because it is so pure, aging is either not required or will take less time. I aired mine for 2 days and cut some to 40% and it was VERY drinkable white.

Disclaimer: I am on Gen V of my UJ so it is getting really good now and that will account for something. Also, this Gen V has been sitting for about 3 months on the grain after it was fermented out.

All I can say is that if you have any motivation to try something new, try this.

Smaug

No offense, but that argument and misconception has been realized for a while as I recall.

It is just not that easy to shake all of the flavor out of a grain bill or a rum beer by collecting at 94 or even 95 for that matter. That's why we often see the big vodka rigs sporting such a high plate count. Specialty vodkas like the 3bees vodka absolutely benefit from a minimal plate count. But a vodka nerd might insist that the 3 bees is not neutral enough. I think it is wonderful however.

Some would however say that collecting whiskey in that range makes an insipid spirit. A good friend who's opinion I respect say's if you want good whiskey you have to put it up dirty. He was referring to a barrel aged product btw.

For me, white whiskey is quite lovely collected at the higher purity levels. Most pros that make their moonshine with an AG grain bill are doing this. And these are the moonshines that I personally look to purchase over the lesser sugarhead recipes. I highly recommend Baum Brothers out of Chicago,,,,,Kevin over at Smokey Quartz is pretty dern good too.

There is plenty of room to love all styles IMO.

FloridaCracker

Since I have only been back in the game for less than a year, I'm sure that there is a lot that I have missed and this is probably one facet. As you can probably tell by now, I am relatively impatient! That is probably why I was so shocked at what I was pulling at 94. A smooth drinkable whiskey, albiet a hybrid. I got more grain flavor out of this run than any I have ever done. Most of my UJ runs to date taste more like rum than whiskey. Of course it could be the new still as well.

Just another arrow in the quiver for those who want something quicker.

rossco

@FloridaCracker said: Most of my UJ runs to date taste more like rum than whiskey. Of course it could be the new still as well.

FC are you using raw sugar? Sometimes In the past I have used raw sugar to make white rum. If you want a more distinct whiskey flavour, you can try using white sugar for your UJ. My UJ and rum taste nothing alike.

grim

Heard someone describe this process once as a Grain Eau De Vie, which sounds very appropriate.

Smaug

@grim said: Heard someone describe this process once as a Grain Eau De Vie, which sounds very appropriate.

+1

Davin would have rather pulled his 3Bees off at 92ish + or - and called it Honey Eau De Vie. But he was afraid that his potential market would not have been able to get their head around the "Eau De Vie" word. So he elected to make "vodka" to insure that he could capture as much market as possible.

punkin

Yes a good method that's been around a lot longer than Odin.

A lot of whiskey distilleries use plated stills i believe.

My favourite spirit of all is white rum pulled off at 95.6 through a VM column. It's got heaps of flavour.

rossco

My favourite spirit of all is white rum pulled off at 95.6 through a VM column. It's got heaps of flavour.

Yeah it is really nice. Always have a couple of gallons hanging around, generally use a little molasses these days, and 5 plates in a single run.

Favorite for mine would be silver mexican with a dash of fresh squeezed finger limes. Yum.

Smaug

Sounds delightful.

punkin

@Smaug said: Sounds delightful.

Rum slut. :ar!

Smaug

Guilty as charged.

grim

TTB - Light "Light Whiskey"

FloridaCracker

@rossco said: FC are you using raw sugar? Sometimes In the past I have used raw sugar to make white rum. If you want a more distinct whiskey flavour, you can try using white sugar for your UJ. My UJ and rum taste nothing alike.

I use just white sugar for my UJ and for rum a combination of molasses and brown sugar.

I know that this type of whiskey won't ever win any awards but I was really caught off guard at the amount of flavor that could be had after running at that high of an ABV. Another plus to this is not trying to figure out what to blend back in with the hearts. Once the still was set to pull the 94 I didn't touch it again. Really slowed down and then the onset of tails was a no brainer.

I figured that Odin wasn't the first as he credits Smiley's book with the idea but I did get the idea from him, thus the credit. Hell, I might just start drinking a lot more white. But my rum has really stepped it up too. So much to drink and so little time.

CothermanDistilling

@Smaug said: Sounds delightful.

taste the bottle of 727 I gave you labeled batch 2... that is more of a grain eau-de-vie than a vodka... batches 3 and 4 are more like true vodka.. the current plan for a new label is the batch 2 process done somewhat like FC mentions, maybe a little tighter cuts maybe not...... need to have FC up for a bullshit session some day....

rossco

@FloridaCracker said: So much to drink and so little time.

Relax FC if you don't get to it for a while, it gets better :))

FloridaCracker

But I want to drink it all. RIGHT NOW

FloridaCracker

@CothermanDistilling said: need to have FC up for a bullshit session some day....

Mike, I'm only about an hour from you. Been meaning to stop by.

Clickeral

@punkin said: Yes a good method that's been around a lot longer than Odin.

A lot of whiskey distilleries use plated stills i believe.

My favourite spirit of all is white rum pulled off at 95.6 through a VM column. It's got heaps of flavour.

White rum from a single pass off a 4 plater is pretty dam good :all my friends love it and it doesn't last long, I have one bottle left atm and I am guarding it. I have to put more on but finding a petstock that sells molasses in the city is hard

I need to give brandon molasses a call

FloridaCracker

I'm going to be running another batch of rum this week and will definitely leave some white.

rossco

@FloridaCracker said: I'm going to be running another batch of rum this week and will definitely leave some white.

Rum I aim at is one or the other. Dark has dunder, more molasses and is stilled between 80-90% where white rum has no dunder more raw sugar and is stilled between 92-96%. I don't like the taste of dunder in white rum, and it is less oily (for want of a better word).

punkin

@rossco said: Rum I aim at is one or the other. Dark has dunder, more molasses and is stilled between 80-90% where white rum has no dunder more raw sugar and is stilled between 92-96%. I don't like the taste of dunder in white rum, and it is less oily (for want of a better word).

I 100% agree with this comment. I have two different recipes and two different methods depending on how the rum is to be aged. I also cut white rum with always some very late sweet heads and sometimes even a touch of the earliest tails. I call it H&T Rum.

I don't include heads with dark rum, but i will search low in the tails for that special jar you found.

FloridaCracker

Well, the dunder is in so I will have to try for some sort of hybrid. I like a full bodied rum so when I say "white" it probably isn't what most would want or think of as a white or light. These trials are kinda all over the board and probably hard for an outsider to follow but I figured that someone, somewhere might pick up something useful. I can already tell that the aged dunder will be a success. Just how much, I will have to wait until it has aged a while. Punkin, if I could bottle that first jar of tails on a consistent basis, I would never have to experiment again. It was like, well, butter on a stick.

punkin

All good mate, i am following with interest your disgusting experiments. :D

FloridaCracker

Thanks. You know, one night last week I was out in the garage working late and heard a few sounds. Not sure what they were and as I was locking up and leaving I felt like something was following me. Now that I look back on it, I think that it might have been the dunder.

Clickeral

My white rum comes from the below

10L backseat from the last run 6L or 5kg ish of Molasses 1/4 cup lowans yeast

Ferments out in about 1-2days but I let it sit about a week

I run my still as per normal and only take hearts cuts :) its pretty good

Really rummy white rum but not as complex as the gold rum (French or American oak)

I haven't made any dark rum yet

Sunshine

@clickeral: at what temperature do you ferment?

Clickeral

@Sunshine said: clickeral: at what temperature do you ferment?

As warm as I can get it normally between 20-30C depending on the time of year