DIY Power Controller

bentstick

being in the states, i will say yes they will need to be GFI,if not Arc fault circuit interrupter protection(aficp) from the panel( ground fault installed in the Panel) Imo if you can get away with just a GFI, you r rockin, them damn breakers in the panel ain't worth a shit they are sorely under rated!

DeBluesDoctor

If @Finespirit would report back, I'd like to know about your experience with the local electrician and the heater wiring installation. Thanks.

Finespirit

Ok, will do.

Grudaire

So long as you have a gfci upstream you are fine.

grim

You can't run this on one GFCI - the amperage requirements are too high to realistically find the breakers. If you are in US, you are looking at dedicated 30 amp circuits with # 10 wiring for each element. That means 5 double pole GFCI or Arc Fault breakers (you are probably looking at like $300-400 in ground fault breakers from your electrician, I wouldn't even wager a guess for the arc faults - or maybe I will, double that price?). In some areas I think you may be able to swing by with # 12 depending on the insulation and application, but I wouldn't go that route for this, since this isn't intermittent use (and probably won't pass in commercial). This will all need to be sized for 27,500 watts plus some overhead.

Depending on how far your main panel is from the still, you might need to consider a dedicated sub-panel - which would be more labor, but might save you money because of the more simplistic wiring arrangement. Since if you are really far the electrician might even want to push to # 8. You are looking at a 150 amp sub panel, which is pretty big. And don't fall over when you see the price of 1/0 copper to feed it (I figure about $10usd per foot from the main panel to the sub for an estimate price, wiring and conduit, no labor).

grim

Another factor to consider is using a larger controller enclosure such that you can hardwire both the controller and the element wiring. I'm no electrician, but I believe in a hardwired configuration, GFCI actually wouldn't be a code requirement, even if they tried to classify the area as a commercial kitchen. Good idea sure, but that's different than requirement.

In addition, with 5 elements, you'll be spending another small fortune on boxes, receptacles, and plugs for 240v/30a.

CothermanDistilling

If you really think you need GFCI (I don't think you do), buy a hot-tub sub panel, 50A 240v gfci and box cheaper than just the gfci by itself... googling, I found a 60A one, it will do 2 30A circuits for elements...

fadge

@bigbird123 Hopefully one of the resident experts that deal with 110v will chime in. I can handle AU 240v but won't try to assume the CORRECT wiring for your needs.

Come on guys, who has the knowledge ?

@law_of_ohms yep I will pour myself another drink cause I lost my post for a while, thought I may have had too many already as I was sure I hit the reply button..

Fadge

Law_Of_Ohms

Did some cleaning up and move a few split topics back into this main thread.

Dont like it? well relax and go and have a home brew.

Mischief

Bought one of these of Punkin & put it together yesterday using the Aus diagram. Tested it out on the jug/kettle & works brilliantly. Looking forward to the fine control.

Law_Of_Ohms

found that diy controller thread back!

ozarks_irishman

Just a thought..could you use the controller through a Pid thus controlling both voltage and temperatures??

Mickiboi

@ozarks_irishman said: Just a thought..could you use the controller through a Pid thus controlling both voltage and temperatures??

No they are a different Solid Stare Relay, the kit is a resistance controlled and the PID is a voltage controlled.

Lloyd

Thanks @Mickiboi for jumping in. Saw this post earlier today but got busy and couldn't chime in.
@ozarks_irishman please review the last few pages of this thread, the DIY controller, or any controller, is not an effective way to control the still - that's done by controlling the vapor temp above the dephlegmator. Trying to control the boiler with a PID does not work and the DIY is simply for tuning the boiler power.
Example; using full element power for faster boil up then using a controller to dial back the heat for the production run.

A PID controller is very useful to control the dephlegmator to set the vapor temperature so the product is at a consistent ABV.

Two completely different controllers.

And, by the way, glad you are here. Enjoy the ride, lots to learn here.

ozarks_irishman

Thanks for the replies and advice! I have only read up to page 9 before deciding to order the DIY kit...wasn't available as a kit, but most of the parts were. Since I'm a woodworker, I'll build a box for it. Glad to have found this forum, a lot more activity here than in the other two forums that I participate in, so chances of getting all the help and solid advice are more likely to be more forthcoming here.

Smaug

Ask away @ozarks_irishman. There are some really skilled people here and it does seem like the juices flow more frequently here.

DistilliTraK

I used the SD DIY kit as a base and the resultant product was very effective, thanks to the inputs I got here from those that perfected the build before. I am still going to look at a SD control system when they come out - they look just too cool to pass up!

cityshineboy

Hi All,

This post helped me put my build together, so i though i'd include a few photos of my build as i managed to get a amp meter and the heat sink it all in the small box that came with the kit.

I'm missing a fan as i'm still waiting for it to arrive, however its pretty much operational as i'm only powering a small 2,000 Watt element.

Let me know what you think, its the first time I've built something like this but i must say i'm quite proud of myself :)

Thanks.

punkin

Looks fantastic mate, i was asking in your email if i could post those pics, but you beat me to it.

It all squeezes in there nicely even with the extras. DA:O

cityshineboy

Thanks @punkin,

For anybody interested in copying the design, you'll need to shave half of the tab on the heat sink so it fits in the controller box. Decided to buy a Dremel for this project but I'm sure I'll get future use out of it :)

I also found some photos from the early on in the build and attached below.

I was going to use a 12v power pack however decided it was too big and would restrict the airflow for the fan and wouldn't fit with the Amp Meter. Found a 5v Fan on eBay and a Nokia slim line charger which outputs 5v @ 350mA which is more than enough to run a brush-less 5v fan. Still waiting for the fan to arrive :(

Appreciate any feedback.

Oh its worth noting I'm only running a 2000 Watt element, if I upgrade to a bigger boiler/still in the future I will change the internal wiring to heaver gauge wiring.

• The Switch was purchased from Jaycar (rated to 15A) aprox $2-4
• The female plug socket was purchased at Bunnings (Aussie hardware store) about $4
• Amp Meter purchased on eBay
• Nokia power adapter was a old one I had lying around

CityShineBoy

CothermanDistilling

Has anyone here hooked a DIY controller up to 208V, did the stock pot make it work less, like 10-100% or 0-90%? Or was it the other way around... just have 10% of the pot be non-used?

SeanGC

@cityshineboy said: Hi All,

This post helped me put my build together, so i though i'd include a few photos of my build as i managed to get a amp meter and the heat sink it all in the small box that came with the kit.

I'm missing a fan as i'm still waiting for it to arrive, however its pretty much operational as i'm only powering a small 2,000 Watt element.

I'm looking to build a controller for my 2,250 Watt element. Did you purchase all of your parts from the DIY Still Dragon Controller page? Or did you find a 100K 1W @ 110VAC potentiometer? If so, would you mind sharing where you purchased it?

cityshineboy

@SeanGC said: I'm looking to build a controller for my 2,250 Watt element. Did you purchase all of your parts from the DIY Still Dragon Controller page? Or did you find a 100K 1W @ 110VAC potentiometer? If so, would you mind sharing where you purchased it?

I used the potentiometer that came with the DIY kit, I haven't run the controller yet but will assess once I run it if i should 'upgrade' to a 100k pot (well 250k for me as I'm using 240VAC).

One of the reasons i put the Amp meter on is that i know exactly how much power the Element will be running at (i.e. Amps x Volts = Power or Watts) so i know how many Watts my element will be running at ± 100Watts due to efficiencies etc...

SeanGC

I'm assuming this potentiometer would work for a 110V Element?

VISHAY SFERNICE P11S1V0FLSY00104KA POTENTIOMETER, LINEAR, 100KOHM, 1W, 10% @ Newark

cityshineboy

Hi @SeanGC, I think it will however i'm no expert so i don't know. I've run the controller a few times now and it works well, i use the scale print out as a guide and for a reference point for the next run, however the Amp meter really lets me know what's going on. The controller seems to have the control between 30-90%. Above 90% there is little change and below 30% little change, but i think this is due to the 500k Ped that it comes with.

I'm using 240v and a 2000w Element.

Myles

I run two controllers. One is a 16A burst fired regulator with zero volt cross over. This operates over the full 0% to 100% range. The other is a component built 40A (pintoshine) phase angle controller. Now this one has a trigger voltage so it does NOT operate over the full range. You have to turn up the potentiometer control to a certain point before it will switch on.

However, once switched on, you can then back off the pot again to BELOW the trigger voltage to get a lower power output. This seems to be common on many phase angle controllers.

Neither are absolutely linear in their output, so it does help to calibrate them so that you know what is going on. My power is slightly unstable and on some days my 240 v supply seems to drop to about 220 v which does impact onto the power delivered by the controller.

I haven't included a supply voltage indicator on my controller, but it is something I am considering for the future. :bz

Brewhaha

I'm asking if the life of the SSR can be increased by running a varistor 391K across the active input and output. Also in the downloadable PDF for the kit it does not say which is positive and negative on the pot or which terminal each should go to ? does it matter. I'm no electronics buff but I can not afford to pay a sparky to wire it. I purchased a Energy Power Watt Voltage Volt Meter Monitor Analyzer Ammeter AU Plug Tester from eBay to plug in on the outlet end to show wattage voltage amps and time run. I have a kegking 2200 watt element and are hoping to get it down to 1750 watts :)] . If anyone has a similar setup I'd like to hear how its going!

punkin

I don't know anything at all about electronics mate. I only know it was designed by someone who does and that there are hundreds of them across the country and around the world all working.

I'd be much more scared of that element than anything else. Have a bit of a google about them. I had a customer tell me a few weeks ago that they have had 5 blow up, no problems getting them replaced, but a scary thing to be dealing with.

Lloyd

Pretty sure that instructible is for the USA flavor of electricity.
Generally the dark wires are hot, white is neutral and green, of course, is earth.
@Brewhaha since you are in AUS its so much simpler since the 240v is one just one wire instead of split phase over two 120v wires.

I'm like Punkin, not well versed in electrics, but if you ask a very pointed question here, like where does this wire go?, someone smarter than us will always chime in.

As for wiring the pot to the SSR, just read through the instruction again. Mind the view so you connect to the 2 correct legs on the pot. The middle leg of the three pot legs (one outer leg is unused) goes to terminal number 3 on the SSR. If the middle leg is wired correctly but you chose the wrong outer leg then your dial will be exactly opposite of what you want. 0 will be 100% instead of 0 and 100% will be 0. If so, just wire to the other pot leg.
I suck at electronic stuff and am worse at trying to help with it. I've built several for myself now and it does get heaps easier (mind you at the very beginning I didn't have the guidance that's available now and I mercilessly electrocuted my first SSR). But its death was quick and, at least for me, mostly painless. I paid twice as much back then for single SSR as a complete SD DIY kit costs now.

Your mileage will vary, seek professional help, may the force be with you, stand back please.... (my little prayer before plugging in anything electronic for the first time).

Mickiboi

@Brewhaha said: I'm asking if the life of the SSR can be increased by running a varistor 391K across the active input and output.

Short answer. Yes you can put it across the load but it wont extend the life of the SSR. A MOV is designed to stop back EMF from entering into sensitive electronics. Since there is very little magnetic field on the element when it switches off to collapse and create that back EMF compared to a motor or load coil it wont help you. So put it on if you like it, wont damage anything.